From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 2 00:21:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 00:21:11 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <345C4759.443BF77B@istar.ca> Date: Sun, 02 Nov 1997 01:26:51 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com, cstup@pobox.com Subject: Re: WG 19V2000 BW Vector monitor manual needed References: <342857ca0.5163@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> <199709232335.TAA12575@po_box.cig.mot.com> <9709240907.ZM23850@calcite> <3459FE18.6C5E@an.hp.com> <345A6AAB.251E@pobox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Corey Stup wrote: > This is from a Asteroids Dlx upright - need copies or an original. > Email if you have one available. > > Thanks! We have photocopies of just about all the XY monitors (and most other raster ones) available...Asking $23US includes postage to USA, and often some scribbled tech notes on the margins of the pages.... John :-#)# (sorry about the add, but I thought some would be interested...) -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr@flippers.com, web page http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 2 00:24:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 00:24:55 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <345C4838.8FB67C96@istar.ca> Date: Sun, 02 Nov 1997 01:30:34 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Question for mailing list group References: <342857ca0.5163@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> <199709232335.TAA12575@po_box.cig.mot.com> <9709240907.ZM23850@calcite> <3459FE18.6C5E@an.hp.com> <345A6AAB.251E@pobox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi, all! What is the consensus here regarding advertisements of a vector nature? I have a few games that I would like to sell (Star Trek, Star Wars, etc...) and I don't get rgvam on my server (why I don't know). Would an auction run in this area be unseemly? Or prices posted? Or what? Thanks! John :-#?# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr@flippers.com, web page http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 2 16:47:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 16:46:57 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Question for mailing list group Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 00:47:05 GMT Message-ID: <345d15bb.448300@smtp.concentric.net> References: <342857ca0.5163@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> <199709232335.TAA12575@po_box.cig.mot.com> <9709240907.ZM23850@calcite> <3459FE18.6C5E@an.hp.com> <345A6AAB.251E@pobox.com> <345C4838.8FB67C96@istar.ca> In-Reply-To: <345C4838.8FB67C96@istar.ca> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Sun, 02 Nov 1997 01:30:34 -0800, John Robertson wrote: >Hi, all! >What is the consensus here regarding advertisements of a vector nature? >I have a few games that I would like to sell (Star Trek, Star Wars, >etc...) and I don't get rgvam on my server (why I don't know). Would an >auction run in this area be unseemly? Or prices posted? Or what? >Thanks! >John :-#?# Is this up for voting? I wouldn't mind one post as to condition, price and whereabouts of a game -- assuming there was some special price or condition that would make it applicable to 'vectorlist'. Like: "I have a broken Asteroids here in the SF area, I've tried everything to get it to work and am giving up. So I'm wondering if some hardware guru, here on Vectorlist, will take it off my hands for $100, case looks great... blah blah" or, "I'v designed some boards that allow you to switch between SW and ESB and I'm asking $99 for them, let me know if your interested" -- At Clay's prices, I don't see him retiring, or even paying rent on the profits from those board. And even if he was, this would still be a good place to post because of the uniqueness of the product. If one is not offering any special or unique deals, I don't see why it needs to be posted to 'vectorlist'. Mailing lists are easy to create, if needed it would be easy enough for someone to start a 'vectorlist.marketplace'. So far it's been very nice having a noise free mailing list. It would seem a shame, simply because this list's subscription base has become large enough to support an auction, to start throwing advertisements between the "real posting" -- much like a magazine would. I don't see where an auction would help anyone but the sole individual running the auction, and that could be done in private emails, or on a newsgroup somewhere. IMHO. Of course Al Kossow started and maintains this list, and we are all here as his guests. To quote from the original "Welcome" message: "I've created an automated mailing list for people interested in the technical aspects of vector games called vectorlist@spies.com." What he says goes! On the other hand I'm bummed because while I seem to be able to get every 'alt.bad.taste.porn.hate.racist.sexist.binaries' created, I also don't get RGVAM -- which would be a great place to run an auction! There are times when I like ads, and have no problems in participating in auctions! -Zonn From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 2 20:34:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 20:34:41 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: jeffh@mail.diac.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 21:38:20 -0700 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: jeffh@diac.com (Jeff Hendrix) Subject: Re: Question for mailing list group Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I think it would be OK to make LIMITED posts of prices here. I think they should be limited to vector games and parts and only posted once every couple of weeks or so (not everyday until the game sells). I also think this would NOT be a good place to run an auction, I wouldn't want my mailbox stuffed each day with new bids on a game. I think that stuff should be posted in the news groups. just my $.015 -jeff >Hi, all! >What is the consensus here regarding advertisements of a vector nature? >I have a few games that I would like to sell (Star Trek, Star Wars, >etc...) and I don't get rgvam on my server (why I don't know). Would an >auction run in this area be unseemly? Or prices posted? Or what? >Thanks! >John :-#?# >-- > John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 > Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) > mailto:jrr@flippers.com, web page http://www.flippers.com > "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." jeffh@diac.com Buy/Sell/Trade Classic Video Arcade Games www.diac.com/~jeffh/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 07:52:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 07:52:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <345DF4C9.7ED9@an.hp.com> Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 10:59:05 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Amplifone help needed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi all, This past weekend was a dark time for my Amplifones .. I need some serious help. I'll explain the best that I can. Last week, my WinTron unit arrived, so I decided to install it this weekend. Originally, I had one completely working HV board with the red transformer, and I had one non-working HV board. In the non-working board, I replaced the BU406D just for grins, installed a cap kit, and basically tested every component to make sure that it was going to work when I installed a working HV transformer into it. Because I knew that my working board was in good shape, I decided to install the WinTron unit into it. I figured that if I install the WinTron into board #2, and it has a problem, I might break the WinTron. I installed the WinTron into board #1, and the working red HV transformer into board #2. Now here is where the problems began. I hooked #1 up, and the screen was incredibly bright, and all the colors were washed out. Everything was white. The neck of the crt was glowing much brighter than it ever had normally, and then the monitor display changed and only displayed RED. I assumed that the brightness was just turned up too high, so I turned it down. The brightness did decrease ever so slightly, but not enough. Even in the lowest position, the screen was still blazing away like you wouldn't believe. I checked my HV, and it was at the appropriate 19.5KV. I figured that perhaps my drive and bias pots needed serious adjustment with this new transformer, so I exercised those pots and saw only miniscule effects on screen. Basically, what I can tell is that the heater is glowing entirely too brightly, and I can't turn the brightness down enough. I verified that all wires going to the focus block are good. I even measured the block with my ohm-meter to make sure that none of the resistors opened up. They all checked out good. I triple checked all my wiring of the HV transformer before powering up. I can't figure out what possibly is the problem. The only guess I have is that the WinTron unit is defective and its outputting at least the wrong heater voltage ... What I don't know is whether or not a brightly glowing heater would cause this symptom or not. I even tried lowering the HV, and this had no effect on the screen brightness. All it did was shrink the size of the screen. ------- Ok, so I had some bad luck with #1. I figured that I'd at least get #2 working. I hooked it up, and I got HV, (I could hear it!) but the heater didn't even glow! ARGH! No picture, needless to say. ------- Now that I had sucessfully destroyed two HV boards, I figured I'd continue. I decided to try to get back to a working state. I removed the WinTron, and put the original HV transformer back into board #1. I even swapped a different tube into the mix (known working) and another deflection board with properly adjust gain and bias pots. When I turned this on, I had an over bright screen, washed out colors, but a normal heater glow. Fiddling with the screen brightness still was not enough to make the screen dim enough. The HV checked out at 19.5KV. I can't figure out anything else on the monitor that I can possibly adjust to make it look correct. This is driving me mad! I noticed one really weird thing though. I noticed that if I raised then lowered the screen brightness rapidly, that the display would look absolutely NORMAL and perfect for about 1 second, then it would quickly become too bright. I turned it all off and let it stew. I'm really out of ideas for the moment. I can't figure out why it is that any of these problems happened as they did. ------- Basically: 1)Why was the heater voltage too high with the Wintron? Can it be adjusted? 2)If I could lower the heater voltage, would that make the screen less bright? 3)If yes to #2, why was the screen too bright in my 3rd experiment even though the heater glowed normally? 4)Since the HV was measured at the normal 19.5KV, what else can I adjust on the HV board to make the (apparently) out of whack voltages, correct? 5)What do you suppose happened to my red HV unit when I put it into an apparently defective HV board, and then transplanted it back? It still generates HV, heater, etc, and I get a picture (my 3rd experiment). 6)Is it possible that the WinTron unit is defective, and that now I also have a bad red HV unit to boot? At least I am learning. :-) At least, that's what my wife tries to remind me of. That's what I tell her when I have all these failed experiments. :-) But this time, it's getting harder to remember that. If you have some time, and some clues, I'd really enjoy hearing from you. I'll provide more details if you have more questions. Thanks! Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 08:18:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 08:18:22 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:17:54 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Amplifone help needed In-Reply-To: <345DF4C9.7ED9@an.hp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hey Joel, Check your Video B+. It's supposed to be 180V. The installation instructions (the original Atari ones, at least) say that after installing the new HV transformer you should "Adjust the frequency of primary switching to get a video B+ of 180V" You use R7 (I think that's it -- it's the pot near the 555 timer) to do this. I'm thinking that your colors might be overdriving because the Video B+ may be too high. I have a similar problem (Deflection seems good, but I only get bright, white vectors) that I've shelved for the time being, and it is definitely a deflection board problem (My heater doesn't glow any different from normal, though...) It's wierd that you're getting proper HV and bad heater voltages, since they both come off of the HV transformer. Since you didn't mention messing with R7 you might try it and see. Did you measure the heater voltage, just for kicks? Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 08:42:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 08:42:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <345E008C.7766@an.hp.com> Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 11:49:16 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Amplifone help needed References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > > Check your Video B+. It's supposed to be 180V. The installation > instructions (the original Atari ones, at least) say that after installing > the new HV transformer you should "Adjust the frequency of primary > switching to get a video B+ of 180V" You use R7 (I think that's it > -- it's the pot near the 555 timer) to do this. I'm thinking that your > colors might be overdriving because the Video B+ may be too high. I have > a similar problem (Deflection seems good, but I only get bright, white > vectors) that I've shelved for the time being, and it is definitely a > deflection board problem (My heater doesn't glow any different from > normal, though...) I didn't check the B+. Though, since the B+ is also controlled in the same manner as the HV, and the HV is correct, how can I change the B+ (If it is too high) without affecting the HV? That is, is it more important to have the B+ at 180V, or the HV at 19.5K? (I did exercise R7 and lowered it all the way but the problem did not get any better). The problem that you describe with your hardware sounds exactly like what's going on here. I know that the deflection boards are good. They worked perfectly before I had this brilliant idea .. :-( It seems that the HV/B+ is the only adjustable voltage. What's left to do? > > It's wierd that you're getting proper HV and bad heater voltages, > since they both come off of the HV transformer. Since you didn't mention > messing with R7 you might try it and see. Did you measure the heater > voltage, just for kicks? I didn't measure the heater voltage. Any idea what it should be? I'm assuming something around (6.3 to 7VAC), since it needs to be compatible with the WG tubes ... and that's about what they use. Thanks for the reply. Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 13:38:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 13:37:51 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 16:37:18 -0500 (EST) From: Dangerwil@aol.com Message-ID: <971103151229_1035243587@emout07.mail.aol.com> To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Found some diodes Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com All, Whilst digging in the parts room I discovered a box with some flyback diodes in it. The invoice was dated 12-2-82! 3) Varo H386C-12 48S137114 (Diode symbol) 7925 3 silicone insulators 1) Varo H 386CI D2Y Any ideas? Are these the Asteroids diode? Or are they for the motorola Space Invaders monitor. If anybody wants 'em they should be cheap. Bill From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 15:29:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:29:43 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: HP 5004A Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 23:31:42 GMT Message-ID: <34615b54.248084756@tommy.doctord.com> References: <971103151229_1035243587@emout07.mail.aol.com> In-Reply-To: <971103151229_1035243587@emout07.mail.aol.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com HP 5004A -- I just found one of these at a local surplus store that looks nearly brand new for $85. So I bought it. (For those who don't recognize the number, this is a Signature Analyser that can be used in conjunction with the Cinematronics exercisor.) They had another one also in nice condition for $47.50, it might have been missing some of the small leads that connect to the start/stop/clock module -- they look easily replaceable. And if it matters, the little piece of cellophane that covers the display when it's new, was still attached. But it didn't have the accessory pouch, and the tip of the probe had been filed down once, so I bough the other one. But if anyone else is interested, and is willing to drive to the San Diego North County Area (CA of course), then E-mail me and I'll tell you how to get there. But back to my selfish reason for posting: Does anyone have an operators/service manual I could get a copy of? I've already called HP and they no longer carry the manual, though you *might* be able to get a microfiche of the thing, I didn't try. (If anyone else is interested, the HP ordering number is: 1-800-227-8164 and the part number for the microfiche is: 05004-90002) Thanks! -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 15:32:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:32:44 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:32:41 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: HP 5004A Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "But back to my selfish reason for posting: Does anyone have an operators/service manual I could get a copy of?" I'd be interested in a copy to, or if someone would scan it in, I can put it up on spies. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 3 19:50:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 19:50:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: "Rhea, Cristopher J." (Cris Rhea) Message-Id: <199711040348.VAA24209@sijer.Mayo.EDU> Subject: Re: HP 5004A To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 21:48:31 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <34615b54.248084756@tommy.doctord.com> from "Zonn" at Nov 3, 97 11:31:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Send a note to linda_p@ix.netcom.com. She runs a company called Manual Merchant.... Has or can find manuals for almost any test instrument.... --- Cris ----------------------------------------------------------- Cristopher J. Rhea Mayo Foundation Research Computing Facility Guggenheim 1001B crhea@Mayo.EDU Rochester, MN 55905 Fax: (507) 266-4486 (507) 284-0587 ----------------------------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 08:57:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 08:57:29 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: From: "Ozdemir, Steve" To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 08:57:12 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com G'day folks, This is a simple (and perhaps stupid) question. I found two spare audio regulator boards from a Tempest and Gravitar while I was digging around in my storage unit this morning. I was considering doing that conversion that Ray documented a while back where I modify my Asteroids to play Asteroids Deluxe also. As I remember, the only major modification was swapping out the Asteroids audio regulator board for a more advanced version (Audio Reg II?). Is either the Tempest or Gravitar audio regulator board advanced enough? (The Gravitar audio regulator board didn't look "populated enough" to be an Audio Reg II.) Thanks in advance for any help! Steven S Ozdemir sso@dsc.com ps - I'm putting together my Tempest cocktail for sale for anyone who might be interested in California. Because I've run out of money for storage, I'll have to be parting with this nice piece (and as you can imagine I'll be looking for as much as I can get for it since I'd like to avoid selling off any more of my collection for storage costs). From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 09:40:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 09:40:37 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 09:41:38 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega multigame- Works! Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com A bit of progress to report. The Multigame hardware came up last night fully functional with the menu system. :-) ***********Techy part:************ It was a bit more complicated than I thought. :-/ The main problem was that it turned out I couldn't use 0xf000-0xffff in ROM without hardware modification. (0xd000-0xdfff, 0xe000-0xefff, and 0xf000-0xffff all decode from the same location in the PROM on the CPU board, so it's tricky to get 0xf000 to map to something *on* the CPU board since the backplane bus transceiver is active.) The menu system now resides at 0xc000-0xc7ff, that's right below RAM, and I can control it without messing with anything else in the PROM. I store the graphics for the menu in the Space Fury bank of memory. When the menu is called it switches to bank 2, reads the graphics into vector RAM, and then jumps to 0xc000 area to run the menu. Works dandy. :-) There's a couple little things left to do-- I've got the current 22V10 based GAL design crunched down to a 16V8, but it needs to be tested. Once that's done I can design the PCB and do a run of boards. *********End Techy Part*********** The upgrade is pretty "clean" right now-- A daughtercard, a little PCB that plugs in where the Security Chip goes, and a replacement PROM. Everything is socketed, no permanent modifications to the CPU board required. The actual hardware should work for raster games too. (Need a different menu/eprom obviously.) With a little luck the whole thing might be available around December? -Clay Actually, if you want to write your own game, you could do it with the Daughtercard and have about 768K of usable bank-switched ROM at your disposal. ;-) Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 11:01:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 11:00:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <345F727F.5EB2@an.hp.com> Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 14:07:43 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Ozdemir, Steve wrote: > As I remember, the only major modification was swapping out the > Asteroids audio regulator board for a more advanced version (Audio Reg > II?). Is either the Tempest or Gravitar audio regulator board advanced > enough? (The Gravitar audio regulator board didn't look "populated > enough" to be an Audio Reg II.) Thanks in advance for any help! Tempest uses an Audio Reg II, so if that's what you need, you'll be all set. I'm not familiar with the hack that you're referring to, but Asteroids and Asteroids Deluxe operate off the exact same voltages, so I'm surprised that it says you need the more advanced power supply. What does Ray do with this supply? Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 12:18:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 12:18:33 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:17:59 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar In-Reply-To: <345F727F.5EB2@an.hp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Tue, 4 Nov 1997, Joel Rosenzweig wrote: > Tempest uses an Audio Reg II, so if that's what you need, you'll be all > set. I'm not familiar with the hack that you're referring to, but > Asteroids and Asteroids Deluxe operate off the exact same voltages, so > I'm surprised that it says you need the more advanced power supply. > What does Ray do with this supply? > The problem is that Asteroids Uses a Reg/Audio I board, and Asteroids Deluxe uses a Reg/Audio II board. The gains of the audio amplifiers on those boards are different, and it has to be hacked to get them to both operate at the same volume. Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 12:46:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 12:45:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199711042044.OAA07066@fermat.mayo.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.1mach v148) In-Reply-To: X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.1mach (Enhance 2.0b5) From: Ray Ghanbari Date: Tue, 4 Nov 97 14:42:55 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar References: Organization: Mayo Foundation Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com You wrote: > > What does Ray do with this supply? > > > > The problem is that Asteroids Uses a Reg/Audio I board, and > Asteroids Deluxe uses a Reg/Audio II board. The gains of the > audio amplifiers on those boards are different, and it has to be hacked to > get them to both operate at the same volume. Yup, this is what I did, although the details are a little different. Asteroids uses a AR board, and AD uses an AR I board. Here is the write up I did way back when. Alternative was to mod the output stage on the AD PCB. I tend to not make modifications like these to PCBs, since I hate it when others do this stuff (heck of a time tracking things down if you have to fix it). Ray Addendum to Asteroids -> Asteroids Deluxe conversion Ray Ghanbari ray@mayo.edu 4/9/95 NOTE: you are responsible for what you do, not the author or anyone else. Do not attempt the following conversion unless you know what you're doing and are willing to take responsibility for the results. 'Nuff said. Once you rig up your adapter and start playing, you may notice that the sound is heavily distorted. Fret not, this does not mean that the game is melting down! Asteroids (and other Atari vector games) use an auxillarly board to provide regulated power, and to provide amplification for sound. The Audio/Regulator board in Asteroids Deluxe was the Audio/Regulator I board (A/R I), while Asteroids had a plain old Audio/Regulator board (A/R) If you look at the schematics, the only difference seems to be that the A/R board had additional circuitry to support an Audio Disable signal. Since this pin is always grounded in the traditional Asteroids harness, this part of the circuit is never used. I guess the engineers at Atari decided Audio Disable was no longer necessary, so they removed it from the A/R I board, and subsequently, the Audio/Regulator II (A/R II) board that was used in Battlezone and Red Baron (among others) (As an aside, does anybody know if Lunar Lander used the Audio Disable signal?) Unfortunately, when the Audio Disable circuitry was replaced, the resistor network between the two audio inputs and the audio amplifiers changed, changing the signal amplitude seen by the audio amps. As a result, using the A/R board with Asteroids Deluxe results in the amplified signal being clipped, leading to the heavy distortion that you hear. There are two ways to fix the problem. The first (and easiest) is to replace your A/R board with a A/R I board, or preferably, an A/R II board. The reason to opt for the A/R II board is that the A/R II board added support for additional voltage levels, which you will need if you want to play Battlezone and Red Baron in the same cabinet. Apparently, there are different versions of the A/R II board available, which are configured to supply different voltages. Again, if you have a choice, try to find one that provides -5V (7905 voltage regulator), +12V (7812 voltage regulator), and the standard (?) +22V and -22V (unregulated). These are the additional voltages that are needed by Battlezone. These voltages are segregated on a seperate connector on the A/R II board, and hence should not require any changes to you wiring harness (the rest of the board seems to be pin compatible with the A/R board, but you should double ckeck this) NOTE: Before you risk your electronics, _ALWAYS_ check the line levels on the reegulator board, make sure they match the schematics and your wiring harness. When you finish, repeat the procedure just to be sure. If you do not have access to a ready supply of A/R II boards, then it is fairly simple to modify the audio amplification portion of the A/R board. You will need the following: 2 1k Ohm 1/4W resistors 2 0.22 uF ceramic disc capacitors (25V) First, locate C6 and C15. These are 10uF electrolytic capacitors. If you do not have the schematics handy, follow the traces on the board. Audio 1 comes into pin 9 on connector J7, goes through a 10k Ohm resistor, then connects to the "+" side of C6. Audio 2 comes into pin 8, then into a different 10k Ohm resistor, then goes into the "+" side of C15. Once you locate C6 and C15, replace them with the 0.22uF disc capacitors (orientation doesn't matter with ceramic caps) Next find transistor Q4 and Q6. These are 2N3904's, and are used in the audio disable circuitry. Again, if you don't have schematics, keep following the traces. One leg of Q4 is connected to the "-" side of C6, and one leg of Q6 is connected to the "-" side of C15. Remove these transistors (note that this will make the audio disable circuitry ineffective) You now need to add the 1k resistors. Here is what the final circuit should look like (Audio 2 has the same topology as Audio 1): 0.22 uF 10k + | | Audio 1 ---\/\/\/\/---|----| |---------[...rest of the circuit...] (J7 pin 9) | | | | | / \ / 1k \ / | | | ----- --- - What I did was solder one leg of the 1k resistor to the ground terminal of Q4 (it has a square pad instead of a round pad) and soldered the other end to the lead on the "+" side of the 0.22uF cap. Do this for both audio inputs. For one of the audio inputs, the resistor and cap are close enough that you can connect them directly. For the other, I had to use a length of insulated wire to bridge the components together (double check that nothing is shorting!) Reconnect the board, and the distortion should be gone... (Note, as a side effect, the volume level on Asteroids will be lower than the volume level on Asteroids Deluxe, but that's what the volume control is for ;-) From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 16:32:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:31:57 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: From: "Ozdemir, Steve" To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: RE: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:31:34 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com G'day folks, Thanks, Ray, for resending out that conversion doc! I have a copy at home, but I'm not sure if it has survived that last couple months on my bedstand (given my two toddler's habit of clearing it on a weekly basis). Sounds like I have everything I need to plug and play Asteroids Deluxe into my Asteroids cabinet (expect for an extra shield button)! About the only question I had was, "How can I tell if my Tempest AR II generates +22v and -22v?" I imagine that because this was the first color vector game from Atari that it generates many more voltages than any subsequent game, but I thought I should double check. While I have everyone's attention focussed on the Atari BW, I thought I should poll people about what games they've put into their Atari BW cabinets. Please include what cabinet you started with, what you added and how you did it (ie. plug and play while swapping control panels, menuing system and banked EPROMs, etc.). I know that Kevin Philips added Lunar Lander into his Asteroids/Asteroids Deluxe. Did Doug Jefferys ever figure out how to modify Battlezone board sets to play Red Baron? Does Red Baron's pinouts look anything like Battlezone's pinouts (excluding the control panel inputs)? Steven S Ozdemir sso@dsc.com ps - I have a cabaret Asteroids and caberet Battlezone. The neck of the Asteroids tube almost points straight down to the ground. Seems like it'd be funny playing Battlezone in this position, so I imagine I'll be taking my Asteroids/Asteroids Deluxe set up and moving it to the BZ. Maybe later I'll add Lunar Lander and Red Baron. >---------- >From: Ray Ghanbari[SMTP:ray@mayo.edu] >Sent: Tuesday, November 04, 1997 12:42 PM >To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Subject: Re: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar > >You wrote: >> > What does Ray do with this supply? >> > >> >> The problem is that Asteroids Uses a Reg/Audio I board, and >> Asteroids Deluxe uses a Reg/Audio II board. The gains of the >> audio amplifiers on those boards are different, and it has to be hacked to >> get them to both operate at the same volume. > >Yup, this is what I did, although the details are a little different. >Asteroids uses a AR board, and AD uses an AR I board. > >Here is the write up I did way back when. > >Alternative was to mod the output stage on the AD PCB. I tend to not make >modifications like these to PCBs, since I hate it when others do this stuff >(heck of a time tracking things down if you have to fix it). > >Ray > > > >Addendum to Asteroids -> Asteroids Deluxe conversion > >Ray Ghanbari >ray@mayo.edu >4/9/95 > >NOTE: you are responsible for what you do, not the author or anyone else. Do > >not attempt the following conversion unless you know what you're doing and >are >willing to take responsibility for the results. 'Nuff said. > >Once you rig up your adapter and start playing, you may notice that the sound > >is heavily distorted. Fret not, this does not mean that the game is melting >down! Asteroids (and other Atari vector games) use an auxillarly board to >provide regulated power, and to provide amplification for sound. The >Audio/Regulator board in Asteroids Deluxe was the Audio/Regulator I board >(A/R >I), while Asteroids had a plain old Audio/Regulator board (A/R) > >If you look at the schematics, the only difference seems to be that the A/R >board had additional circuitry to support an Audio Disable signal. Since >this >pin is always grounded in the traditional Asteroids harness, this part of the > >circuit is never used. I guess the engineers at Atari decided Audio Disable >was no longer necessary, so they removed it from the A/R I board, and >subsequently, the Audio/Regulator II (A/R II) board that was used in >Battlezone >and Red Baron (among others) > >(As an aside, does anybody know if Lunar Lander used the Audio Disable >signal?) > >Unfortunately, when the Audio Disable circuitry was replaced, the resistor >network between the two audio inputs and the audio amplifiers changed, >changing >the signal amplitude seen by the audio amps. As a result, using the A/R >board >with Asteroids Deluxe results in the amplified signal being clipped, leading >to the heavy distortion that you hear. > >There are two ways to fix the problem. The first (and easiest) is to replace > >your A/R board with a A/R I board, or preferably, an A/R II board. The >reason >to opt for the A/R II board is that the A/R II board added support for >additional voltage levels, which you will need if you want to play Battlezone > >and Red Baron in the same cabinet. Apparently, there are different versions >of >the A/R II board available, which are configured to supply different >voltages. > Again, if you have a choice, try to find one that provides -5V (7905 voltage > >regulator), +12V (7812 voltage regulator), and the standard (?) +22V and -22V > >(unregulated). These are the additional voltages that are needed by >Battlezone. These voltages are segregated on a seperate connector on the A/R > >II board, and hence should not require any changes to you wiring harness (the > >rest of the board seems to be pin compatible with the A/R board, but you >should >double ckeck this) > >NOTE: Before you risk your electronics, _ALWAYS_ check the line levels on the > >reegulator board, make sure they match the schematics and your wiring >harness. >When you finish, repeat the procedure just to be sure. > >If you do not have access to a ready supply of A/R II boards, then it is >fairly simple to modify the audio amplification portion of the A/R board. >You >will need the following: > >2 1k Ohm 1/4W resistors >2 0.22 uF ceramic disc capacitors (25V) > >First, locate C6 and C15. These are 10uF electrolytic capacitors. If you do > >not have the schematics handy, follow the traces on the board. Audio 1 comes > >into pin 9 on connector J7, goes through a 10k Ohm resistor, then connects to > >the "+" side of C6. Audio 2 comes into pin 8, then into a different 10k Ohm >resistor, then goes into the "+" side of C15. > >Once you locate C6 and C15, replace them with the 0.22uF disc capacitors >(orientation doesn't matter with ceramic caps) > >Next find transistor Q4 and Q6. These are 2N3904's, and are used in the >audio >disable circuitry. Again, if you don't have schematics, keep following the >traces. One leg of Q4 is connected to the "-" side of C6, and one leg of Q6 >is >connected to the "-" side of C15. Remove these transistors (note that this >will make the audio disable circuitry ineffective) > >You now need to add the 1k resistors. Here is what the final circuit should >look like (Audio 2 has the same topology as Audio 1): > > 0.22 uF > 10k + | | > Audio 1 ---\/\/\/\/---|----| |---------[...rest of the circuit...] >(J7 pin 9) | | | > | > | > / > \ > / 1k > \ > / > | > | > | > ----- > --- > - > >What I did was solder one leg of the 1k resistor to the ground terminal of Q4 > >(it has a square pad instead of a round pad) and soldered the other end to >the >lead on the "+" side of the 0.22uF cap. Do this for both audio inputs. For >one of the audio inputs, the resistor and cap are close enough that you can >connect them directly. For the other, I had to use a length of insulated >wire >to bridge the components together (double check that nothing is shorting!) > >Reconnect the board, and the distortion should be gone... > >(Note, as a side effect, the volume level on Asteroids will be lower than the > >volume level on Asteroids Deluxe, but that's what the volume control is for >;-) > From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 18:31:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 18:31:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <01BCE968.0C242FE0@liv41.tir.com> From: Frank Palazzolo To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: G80 speech board question Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 21:24:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Is there really a Votrax chip in any of the Sega games? I assumed all speech comes from the SP0250, and yet there are references to the Votrax chip in the G80 Hardware reference (regarding Space Fury) and in the Astro-Blaster docs. Seems like I'd recognize that Votrax speech if I heard it.. :) Thanks, Frank Palazzolo palazzol@tir.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 4 18:49:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 18:49:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 18:48:58 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: G80 speech board question Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com The PC layout is there on the Sega speech board, but as far as I know, it is never populated. There was one version of the manual which had a schematic for the fully populated board, which is why I included what info I was able to deduce from the drawinings. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 07:05:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 07:05:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199711051502.JAA11716@fermat.mayo.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.1mach v148) In-Reply-To: X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.1mach (Enhance 2.0b5) From: Ray Ghanbari Date: Wed, 5 Nov 97 09:03:21 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar References: Organization: Mayo Foundation Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com You wrote: > While I have everyone's attention focussed on the Atari BW, I thought I > should poll people about what games they've put into their Atari BW > cabinets. Please include what cabinet you started with, what you added > and how you did it (ie. plug and play while swapping control panels, > menuing system and banked EPROMs, etc.). I started with an Asteroids cabinet. I made a coversion harness to play BZ in the same cabinet. basically, I use the rotation buttons for the left BZ control stick, the fire and thrust buttons for the right, and hyperspace to shoot. After ~4 games, you'er fine. I had to build a little regulator board to sub in the extra voltages the BZ expects for the AR II (this was before I had gobs of spare AR boards) Next came Asteroids Deluxe, which was cake (sound was only problem) Next came Lunar Lander. Very similar pinouts to Asteorids. I use Asteroids CP for the buttons, and have a parallel harness coming from the adapter to a hacked PC joystick with suction cups on the bottom. Only trick is to put some resistors in series with the joystick, since LL expects a limited range on the pot voltages (1.5-4V? it's on the schematic) I'm still for a RTC BTW ;-) Next came Red Baron. I just modded my BZ adapter to interface to my hacked PC joystick. RB has same limited voltage range as LL. Bottom line, I play all my BW vector games in my Asteroids cabinet, with a hacked PC joystick as the only control extra. I'm about to revamp these things to interface to the modular control panel scheme I'm using for my JAMMA cabinet (which is why I want a Real Thrust Controller ;-) Ray From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 10:46:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 10:46:22 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3460C096.590A@an.hp.com> Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 13:53:10 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: My Amplifone problems solved Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I figured out both of my Amplifone problems last night that I wrote about on Monday. I'm somewhat embarrassed by what happened, but perhaps someone else will benefit from learning from my mistakes, so I'll present the information here. With the original HV transformer back in the original HV board #1, on the suggestion by Joe, I probed around to see if the B+ was out of whack. I hooked up my volt meter to the output of CR3, and saw a fluctuating 7 - 22vdc. Hmmmmm... It was a far cry from the 180V I expected. Then I hooked up my scope for a quick sanity check. Indeed, I was getting a fluctuating 7 - 22vdc. The next step was to check and see if the winding on the HV transformer had opened up. I removed it, and indeed, found that there was no longer continuity between pins 4 and 8. Usually, this is around 2.3 ohms. I was about to chuck this in the trash when I noticed that one of the transformer wires was no longer connected to pin 4. Ta Da! I had merely a broken wire on my hands. I soldered in back in to place, reinstalled the HV transformer, and powered up the beast. It worked! Woo hoo! That's not the embarassing part though. :-) After getting this unit working, I decided to see if I had destroyed my brand new tube or not. So I installed the new tube into my test chassis. I powered everything up, and it didn't work. The tube displayed the same symtoms as it did originally - i.e. washed out picture, then the display turned all red, etc. And, the heater was glowing way to bright! Defeated, I unhooked everything and decided to put the tube back into its box and put it away for another rainy day. As I was disassembling it, I noticed one of the long pins was BENT, and it bent in such a way that it was now lined up to insert into a different pin receptacle in the neck socket!!!! DOUGHT! I straightened this pin, and tried again. This time, everything worked perfectly. It shouldn't have taken me this long to figure this out, but at least in the end I saw the problem and nothing was damaged. After this victory, I installed the old red HV unit into board #2, and that board came to life for the first time since I've owned it. Now I have two working Amplifones.. woo hoo! I still have two more HV units to work on, but I haven't even attempted to fix them yet. Perhaps some time this weekend. I hope someone else learns something useful from this experience. Now I can install one Amplifone into Tempest, and the other into Star Wars. These Amplifones just look so good! Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 11:00:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:00:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971105130101.0094e100@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 13:01:03 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 12:32 AM 10/28/97 -0500, you wrote: > > >I just dumpster dove for 6 old asteroids EHT cages. Sitting on top were two >WG Color EHT cages :: ) :: ) !!! NFS. > >If you need a spare b/w cage, let me know, we can trade for one, etc... All >of them look in good shape, no burnt resistors or cracked flybacks. They >seem to be interchangeable with all versions of the monitors, anyways, I have >never run into a problem. Untested. > >Bill > Bill- Got the HV cages yesterday!!! Thanks a million. Hope you got your check already, 'cause I know your thirsty :) Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 11:05:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:05:47 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971105130737.0092b930@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 13:07:39 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: More Amplifone stuff... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com To all who are wise: Someone (couldn't find the old post) was going to experiment with putting a Amplifone yoke on a *new* 25" tube. I was wondering if they succeeded or not ... as I am desperate to get a 25" tube back into my cockpit. Also, is the yoke sticker the same for the SW upright and cockpit? Thanks in advance, Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 11:07:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:07:46 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971105130928.0092e6d0@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 13:09:32 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 01:01 PM 11/5/97 -0600, you wrote: >At 12:32 AM 10/28/97 -0500, you wrote: >> >> >>I just dumpster dove for 6 old asteroids EHT cages. Sitting on top were two >>WG Color EHT cages :: ) :: ) !!! NFS. >> Many apologizes ... the reply button strikes again :) Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 11:12:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:12:33 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 13:11:52 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19971105130101.0094e100@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 5 Nov 1997, Mit Matelske wrote: > >of them look in good shape, no burnt resistors or cracked flybacks. They > >seem to be interchangeable with all versions of the monitors, anyways, I have > >never run into a problem. Untested. Hey All, Mit's post (it might've been unintentional?) reminded me of a question that I had. What all is swappable between a 19V2000 and a GO-5 (The version with the same connector as the 19V2000, obviously) It looks like Bill was hinting that the HV units can be swapped, but what about the deflection boards. I've got a 19V2000 that gets no picture, it seems like it gets HV (I get a nice spark when I discharge it,) it gets heater glow, and the spot killer's not lit. No fuses are blown, and I've touched up all the solder joints on both the HV board and the def. board. It sure would be nice to swap a GO-5 def. board (I've got a spare working one) in there so I'd know for sure what board was the culprit... Thanks, Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 11:38:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:38:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <3460CC4D.7C413E94@pobox.com> Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 14:43:09 -0500 From: Corey Stup X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > What all is swappable between a 19V2000 and a GO-5 (The > version > with the same connector as the 19V2000, obviously) > > It looks like Bill was hinting that the HV units can be > swapped, > but what about the deflection boards. > > I've got a 19V2000 that gets no picture, it seems like it gets > HV > (I get a nice spark when I discharge it,) it gets heater glow, and the > > spot killer's not lit. No fuses are blown, and I've touched up all the > > solder joints on both the HV board and the def. board. > > It sure would be nice to swap a GO-5 def. board (I've got a > spare working one) in there so I'd know for sure what board was the > culprit... I'd love to get some info on the 19V2000 - I have one that has no HV. No fuses are blown, and both the deflection board and HV boards are very clean, with no previous "repairs".... Anyone have any tips on this chassis? I have an extra Battlezone monitor that would fit nicely - anyone know if the connector pinouts are the same? (Battlezone upright source, Asteroids Dlx upright destination) From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 11:46:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:46:24 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 13:45:55 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? In-Reply-To: <3460CC4D.7C413E94@pobox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 5 Nov 1997, Corey Stup wrote: > I'd love to get some info on the 19V2000 - I have one that has no > HV. No fuses are blown, and both the deflection board and HV boards > are very clean, with no previous "repairs".... Anyone have any tips > on this chassis? Th two monitors are practically identical. I'm just wondering if the intermediate pinouts are identical (I expect that they are -- I'm really looking for someone who's used a GO-5 deflection board in a 19V2000 to just confirm my suspicions.) > I have an extra Battlezone monitor that would fit nicely - anyone know > if the connector pinouts are the same? (Battlezone upright source, > Asteroids Dlx upright destination) > It would work just fine. That's how I tested my Battlezone game board -- with a good GO-5 from my Asteroids Deluxe, instead of the dead 19V2000 in my Battlezone. Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 12:56:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 12:56:21 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19971105125831.0070daa0@frobozz.qualcomm.com> X-Sender: sswazey@frobozz.qualcomm.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 12:58:31 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Scott Swazey Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? In-Reply-To: <971027232617_967386658@emout11.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Bill, I would like to buy one of the Color EHT cages Thanks, -Scott At 12:32 AM 10/28/97 -0500, you wrote: > > >I just dumpster dove for 6 old asteroids EHT cages. Sitting on top were two >WG Color EHT cages :: ) :: ) !!! NFS. > >If you need a spare b/w cage, let me know, we can trade for one, etc... All >of them look in good shape, no burnt resistors or cracked flybacks. They >seem to be interchangeable with all versions of the monitors, anyways, I have >never run into a problem. Untested. > >Bill > > Scott Swazey QUALCOMM Incorporated Work: (619) 657-2419 mailto:sswazey@qualcomm.com V-209H Pager:(619) 683-5210 From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 15:18:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 15:17:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: coinop@mail.telepath.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:17:38 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: coinop@telepath.com (SmashTV) Subject: Re: Need a Asteroids EHT Assembly? Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >I'd love to get some info on the 19V2000 - I have one that has no >HV. No fuses are blown, and both the deflection board and HV boards >are very clean, with no previous "repairs".... Anyone have any tips >on this chassis? I bet everyone here already has this, but I have a complete copy of the 19V2000 manual online in html format online at: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lakes/9862/page01.html I scanned and converted the book long ago, and recently moved my tech info out to Geocities to lower the metered ($$$) traffic across my site. Later all! Timothy Ellis AKA SmashTV (IRC Nickname) From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 15:20:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 15:20:06 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: jeffh@mail.diac.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:19:12 -0700 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: jeffh@diac.com (Jeff Hendrix) Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com That was me, I havn't had a chance to try it yet. My cockpit star wars, with a 19" ampliphone, is behind a cockpit star wars with a wells, which is behind a major havoc. I did use a multimeter and checked the pins on the 25" vers a 19" and I got the exact same readings across identical pins. I put a yoke on it from an ampliphone 19" xy monitor, so all I have left to do is hook it up, plug it in, close my eyes and flip the switch. I'll try and do it this weekend, if you don't hear back from me, I'm probably dead. -jeff ps. Not only is the yoke sticker the same, but the entire front panel is the same (control panel AND monitor bezel). (I didn't realize this until I had an upright sitting next to a cockpit) >To all who are wise: > >Someone (couldn't find the old post) was going to experiment with >putting a Amplifone yoke on a *new* 25" tube. I was wondering if >they succeeded or not ... as I am desperate to get a 25" tube back >into my cockpit. > >Also, is the yoke sticker the same for the SW upright and cockpit? > >Thanks in advance, > >Mit jeffh@diac.com Buy/Sell/Trade classic video arcade games. www.diac.com/~jeffh/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 16:11:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:11:11 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Date: Thu, 06 Nov 1997 00:13:10 GMT Message-ID: <34660327.422145954@tommy.doctord.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:19:12 -0700, jeffh@diac.com (Jeff Hendrix) wrote: >That was me, I havn't had a chance to try it yet. My cockpit star wars, >with a 19" ampliphone, is behind a cockpit star wars with a wells, which= is >behind a major havoc. >I did use a multimeter and checked the pins on the 25" vers a 19" and I = got >the exact same readings across identical pins. I put a yoke on it from = an >ampliphone 19" xy monitor, so all I have left to do is hook it up, plug = it >in, close my eyes and flip the switch. I'll try and do it this weekend, = if >you don't hear back from me, I'm probably dead. > >-jeff > >ps. Not only is the yoke sticker the same, but the entire front panel is >the same (control panel AND monitor bezel). (I didn't realize this until= I >had an upright sitting next to a cockpit) I have a copy of the Amplifone manual in my truck and I looked at it at lunch time. Unfortunately the yoke assembly for the 25" has a different number than the yoke assembly for a 19". This doesn't mean they're not the same thing, just numbered differently. The fact Jeff's two yokes have the same number is a good sign. It could be they original gave them separate part numbers, and then because they were really the same part, used them interchangeably. A stock room nightmare, but done all the time by assemblers and technicians that are working on a deadline and don't have time to wait for someone to put the "right sticker" on a part. Another good sign is that both CRTs are described as 90 degree CRTs. (I think that's the maximum deflection to angle, measured at the guns, to cover the whole screen, but I'm guessing here.) Since the angles are the same, I'm assuming the yokes could be very similar. Also there is no reference made to different HV voltages on 19" and 25" tubes. I thought larger tubes were driven with higher voltages, but that could be that raster tubes have a larger surface area that must be scanned at a faster rate so that the refresh rates are the same as the smaller tubes. Maybe that's not as critical in vector monitors. If this works, this would be cool. Next would be to cross reference the part number on the tube to a common raster monitor that uses the same tube. I want 25" tubes in all my games! I have a friend who says he had a friend who put a 25" in a Tempest, and it was like being there! (Being where? Where was Tempest filmed?) As a side thought, it seems to me that most current picture tubes are rated at 110 degrees (for shorter tubes), that could throw a wrench in the idea of putting a Amplifone yoke on one of the newer 31-33" tubes. Maybe you can just drive the yoke harder... -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 16:23:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:23:38 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:24:38 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Unfortunately the yoke assembly for the 25" has a different number than >the yoke assembly for a 19". This doesn't mean they're not the same >thing, just numbered differently. The fact Jeff's two yokes have the >same number is a good sign. It could be they original gave them >separate part numbers, and then because they were really the same part, >used them interchangeably. For what it's worth, I seem to recall in old Wico catalogs that the replacement Wico part numbers are also the same for the two. Have any of you really looked at the wire used in the yokes to determine what it is? I'd be game to try to hand wrap one of these things if I thought I could get the right wire... ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 16:33:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:33:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Date: Thu, 06 Nov 1997 00:35:07 GMT Message-ID: <34690fdc.425400081@tommy.doctord.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:24:38 -0800, Clay Cowgill wrote: >>Unfortunately the yoke assembly for the 25" has a different number than >>the yoke assembly for a 19". This doesn't mean they're not the same >>thing, just numbered differently. The fact Jeff's two yokes have the >>same number is a good sign. It could be they original gave them >>separate part numbers, and then because they were really the same part, >>used them interchangeably. > >For what it's worth, I seem to recall in old Wico catalogs that the >replacement Wico part numbers are also the same for the two. Very cool. > >Have any of you really looked at the wire used in the yokes to determine >what it is? I'd be game to try to hand wrap one of these things if I >thought I could get the right wire... ;-) It's not the wire, it's the shape. On the outside it looks like a standard coil, but when you take the yoke off you see that on the inside it has been machine formed into just the right shape to fit around the tube. I think it would be similar to winding the coils used in the pancake motors used to spin floppy disk drives -- just a bit harder because of the strange angles of the yoke. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 5 17:42:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:42:26 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:43:10 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >It's not the wire, it's the shape. On the outside it looks like a >standard coil, but when you take the yoke off you see that on the inside >it has been machine formed into just the right shape to fit around the >tube. I think it would be similar to winding the coils used in the >pancake motors used to spin floppy disk drives -- just a bit harder >because of the strange angles of the yoke. I was thinking more along the lines of something like "18 ga magnet wire" or something. I have phrases of "low inductance yoke windings" and crap in my head, dunno if it's marketing hype or if the wire was something special or what... Basically I'm curious if it's just plain old magnet wire and what gauge. That should get you in the ballpark as far as inductance and series resistance. (So it'd be safe to hook up, even if it wasn't formed exactly right.) From there I bet you can get to the "pretty good" picture quality just by hand-forming the coils. There's probably improvements to be made somehow too-- maybe with that slightly square magnet wire or something to keep the size down. Armed with the knowledge of the wire type and a rough turn count you could probably take the yoke off a GO-7, pull all the wire off and wrap a crude XY yoke. IMHO, that's the main stumbling block to making "new" XY monitors. I think we could cobble up the deflection and HV sections, but I doubt we could buy many off-the shelf XY yokes. ;-) (And if anyplace does make them they're probably pretty $pendy.) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 6 04:45:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 04:45:17 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 07:44:49 -0500 (EST) From: Dangerwil@aol.com Message-ID: <971106074448_276417303@mrin41.mail.aol.com> To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Well, I have seen the 25 inch tube being driven by a WG 19 chasis set up, the defelection was adjusted in pretty close, but still much larger than a 19". Judging from the amount of dust, it had been working for quite sometime. It shouldn't be too much different than using 13" B/W parts in a 19" B/W mon. I use them pretty much interchangeably with no problems so far.... Bill From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 6 07:10:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 07:09:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971106091042.00959500@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Thu, 06 Nov 1997 09:10:43 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: More Amplifone stuff... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 07:44 AM 11/6/97 -0500, you wrote: >Well, > > I have seen the 25 inch tube being driven by a WG 19 chasis set up, the >defelection was adjusted in pretty close, but still much larger than a 19". > Judging from the amount of dust, it had been working for quite sometime. > > It shouldn't be too much different than using 13" B/W parts in a 19" B/W >mon. I use them pretty much interchangeably with no problems so far.... > > >Bill > When my 25" tube decided to bite the dust, I did nothing more than rig up some brackets and stick a 19" tube in my SW. Also, along the same lines as Bill, when I had a bunch of games that used g05's I used to swap parts constantly between the 13" cocktails and 19" uprights... Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 7 19:07:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:06:52 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: coinop@mail.telepath.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:06:38 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: coinop@telepath.com (SmashTV) Subject: New mailing list Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hey all. Missing the more peacefull old days of RGVAC, I have started a new tech only mailing list. For info or to join go to: http://www.telepath.com/dgateway/coinop/list.html Thanks Timothy Ellis From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 10 16:27:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 16:27:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client mothost.mot.com, sender jenison@cig.mot.com ) Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 18:26:37 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9711101826.ZM7881@calcite> In-Reply-To: "Mark Jenison" "Re: deadbeat list" (Aug 19, 4:08pm) References: <199708191646.MAA11604@po_box.cig.mot.com> <9708191208.ZM26826@calcite> <9708191608.ZM1035@calcite> X-face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Follow up to Rocky Palmisano... I agreed that a Pac-Man manual would be fine for a replacement. I never heard from him again. Any luck, Mit? On Aug 19, 4:08pm, Mark Jenison wrote: > Subject: Re: deadbeat list > On Aug 19, 12:08pm, Mark Jenison wrote: > > Subject: Re: deadbeat list > > On Aug 19, 11:44am, Mit Matelske wrote: > > > Subject: Re: deadbeat list > > > At 09:18 AM 8/19/97 -0700, you wrote: > > > > > > > >The only two people I know of are Mixon and Rocky. > > > > > > > > > > Would that Rocky happen to be: > > > > > > Rocky Palmisano > > > 5304 1/2 Belle Terre Rd. > > > Marrero, La 70072 > > > > > > If so, I hope I don't regret sending him 20 bucks for a Tac/Scan manual and > > > shemactics this morning... > > > > > > Couldn't ya'll had this conversion yesterday? > > FYI update on Rocky Palmisano... > > He contacted me and said he was going to send me the Tac/Scan manual even > though he had some it to someone else. I told him not to disrupt any current > deals he had with anyone else, and I have him the option of sending me another > manual or refunding my money. > > At least he seemed like he honestly wanted to resolve the matter. Apparently > his divorce was the reason for all the problem he was having with resolving > orders. > > Anyway, I'm just glad to see that things can get resolved in the end... > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com > Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >-- End of excerpt from Mark Jenison From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 10 22:53:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 22:53:39 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 19:51:51 -0600 (CST) From: Frank McIngvale X-Sender: frankm@localhost To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 18:26:37 -0600 (CST) > From: Mark Jenison > To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > Subject: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) > > Follow up to Rocky Palmisano... > > I agreed that a Pac-Man manual would be fine for a replacement. I never heard > from him again. My 2 cents --- Rocky Racoon assured me twice that he would ship my manuals "soon" ... Haven't heard anything in months. I'm out about $53 ... Do I win the prize for "biggest sucker"? frankm From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 07:25:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 07:25:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971111092730.00958460@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:27:41 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 06:26 PM 11/10/97 -0600, you wrote: >Follow up to Rocky Palmisano... > >I agreed that a Pac-Man manual would be fine for a replacement. I never heard >from him again. > >Any luck, Mit? > >On Aug 19, 4:08pm, Mark Jenison wrote: >> Subject: Re: deadbeat list >> On Aug 19, 12:08pm, Mark Jenison wrote: >> > Subject: Re: deadbeat list >> > On Aug 19, 11:44am, Mit Matelske wrote: >> > > Subject: Re: deadbeat list >> > > At 09:18 AM 8/19/97 -0700, you wrote: >> > > > >> > > >The only two people I know of are Mixon and Rocky. >> > > > >> > > >> > > Would that Rocky happen to be: >> > > >> > > Rocky Palmisano >> > > 5304 1/2 Belle Terre Rd. >> > > Marrero, La 70072 >> > > >> > > If so, I hope I don't regret sending him 20 bucks for a Tac/Scan manual >and >> > > shemactics this morning... >> > > >> > > Couldn't ya'll had this conversion yesterday? >> >> FYI update on Rocky Palmisano... >> >> He contacted me and said he was going to send me the Tac/Scan manual even >> though he had some it to someone else. I told him not to disrupt any current >> deals he had with anyone else, and I have him the option of sending me >another >> manual or refunding my money. >> >> At least he seemed like he honestly wanted to resolve the matter. Apparently >> his divorce was the reason for all the problem he was having with resolving >> orders. >> >> Anyway, I'm just glad to see that things can get resolved in the end... >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com >> Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>-- End of excerpt from Mark Jenison > > > Mark- Nope. Droped him a couple of emails in the past couple of weeks, but no response... Thanks for the update, Mit Matelske From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 09:49:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:49:16 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <34689C41.6C3D@an.hp.com> Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 12:56:17 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: ESB / NOVRAM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I've got Clay's ESB Hack Rev 1.0 in my Star Wars, i.e. this is the type without the dual novram setup that I drool over. I've noticed that if I have a high score setting (top 3) in Star Wars, these are retained from game to game, whereas if I switch to ESB, get a top 3 score there, then switch back to SW, it's a gamble whether or not my settings have been destroyed in Star Wars. That is to say that sometimes when I switch between games, I lose my Star Wars high score table, and sometimes, I do not. ESB settings have never been retained. Why is this so? Does anyone else have this problem? I'm going to install a second NOVRAM eventually, but I'd like to know why ESB doesn't always write to it sucessfully. I figure that if it can't write to it now, then it's not going to be able to write to it when it has it's very own. Thanks, Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 10:53:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 10:53:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Cc: "Ozdemir, Steve" Subject: Re: Cine CPU exorsisor data up Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:55:13 GMT Message-ID: <346da7a9.429569102@tommy.doctord.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 15 Oct 1997 14:03:41 -0700, "Ozdemir, Steve" wrote: >G'day Zonn, > >Please provide more details. Who makes this "universal exercisor" and I >assume that the signatures come with it? > >I've never heard of any other signature analysis beyond the Atari Cat >and Cinematronics Exercisor stuff. Was signature analysis used for >other games? I finally got the goods from Gaymond. Apparently he did have the full Cinematronics exercisor from Kurtz-Kash. It contains 14 ICs and looks a lot like the one Steve O. showed me, with very similar plugs, and without a case -- to work it must be plugged into the Kurtz-Kash test fixture where it appears to get nothing but power. I'm now waiting on documentation which resides in Texas... It looks like the KK unit will do the same thing as the Cinematronics, but if you wanted to duplicate one, the stand-alone Cinematronics is the way to go -- though like I said, I think all you need to use this one as a stand alone unit is a power supply. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 11:22:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 11:21:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971111132339.00957100@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:23:51 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Major Havoc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com A couple of questions : 1 . What all does the "quad pokey" daughterboard do? I got a MH boardset yesterday without it. 2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) 3 . What all does the tempest->mh adapter do (once again, no schematics yet) Thanks in advance, Mit Matelske What the hell - anyone got any extras (and tempest->mh adapters) do sell? From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 11:46:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 11:45:48 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 11:46:59 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Major Havoc Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >A couple of questions : > >1 . What all does the "quad pokey" daughterboard do? I got a MH boardset > yesterday without it. This is the source of the sound/music for the game. >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) Yep. Two layer, pretty simple. Main problem there is that it's physically a pretty large PCB. Just be kinda expensive to make. >3 . What all does the tempest->mh adapter do (once again, no schematics yet) It's "active" function is to correct the "bowing" of the display on a Wells Gardner monitor. It might have some passive function to re-route some I/O lines too-- I doubt it though. (Don't recall off the top of my head.) >Thanks in advance, > >Mit Matelske > >What the hell - anyone got any extras (and tempest->mh adapters) do sell? I'm going to make some display correctors (they work with Star Wars/Major Havoc), but the Sega Multigame has been eating all my time... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 11:52:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 11:52:52 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: jeffh@mail.diac.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 12:51:47 -0700 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: jeffh@diac.com (Jeff Hendrix) Subject: Re: Major Havoc Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >A couple of questions : > >1 . What all does the "quad pokey" daughterboard do? I got a MH boardset > yesterday without it. The Quad pokey board is for the sound effects. > >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) I don't think it would be too hard to dupe. if I remember right, there are only 4 pokey chips on it and nothing else (I'll double check tonight) > >3 . What all does the tempest->mh adapter do (once again, no schematics yet) The adapter allows a mh bs to plug directly into a tempest. It also moves the x & y adjustment pots to the adapter (the pots on the main pcb are disabled). I think it might also compensate for pincushioning on a wells monitor. You can just wire up a new harness and just forget about the adapter and everything should work ok (the dedicated hm had no adapter) > >Thanks in advance, > >Mit Matelske > >What the hell - anyone got any extras (and tempest->mh adapters) do sell? jeffh@diac.com Buy/Sell/Trade classic video arcade games. www.diac.com/~jeffh/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 12:12:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 12:12:25 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 12:13:34 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega Multigame (Finally!) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Finally! Ready to roll on the Sega Multigame! I took a prototype over to a friend's house and removed his EPROM card and CPU board and popped the whole thing into a "real" G-80 system. Works like a charm! Found a couple software glitches (a visual one and a control one) but have those fixed now. All "production" parts are verified and the schematic is in OrCAD Capture. I've outputted the netlist and routed a two-layer board with OrCAD Layout Plus. I'll double check the netlist against the prototype and send off for boards probably early next week (or late this week maybe). So... I'm going to order about 16-20 boards. Now's the time for a real headcount on this one. I'll sell the kit to people on this list for $75. That includes the daughtercard (assembled), instructions, a replacement PROM, and the associated software (on the daughtercard). I'm going to pay Dave Fish a royalty on each card to say "thanks" for getting the copy-protection cracked for us. I'm also keeping a cut on these for my time on the menu system and all the software patches to make the games play from a universal control panel. If you want one (or more than one) please send me a note to: clay@supra.com I don't want to get too many extras, but I don't want to get too few either. If you've already sent me a note saying you wanted a board(s) please send it again-- the first request was just to gauge interest level. I'll probably sell any spares over in RGVAM for $100 a pop. (For some reason it seems like my "tech support" level goes up dramatically when "kits" go to people outside of this group of people... ;-) Oh, Al-- your's is free for the EPROMs and pulling all the programming info together. ;-) ------Some specs/techy stuff if you're interested------ The Daughtercard houses a single 27C040 or 27C080 EPROM. (512K or 1024K bytes of ROM.) I'll ship it with a 27C040 that includes: Star Trek Eliminator (plays from Star Trek Control panel) Space Fury (plays from Star Trek Control panel) Tac/Scan (plays from Star Trek Control panel) Zektor (plays from Star Trek Control panel) Eliminator (2player, unmodified except to remove protection) Eliminator (4player, unmodified except to remove protection) Self Test (Runs from inside Star Trek) The Menu system is invoked by pressing the NMI button. There is a space on the PCB to add a couple wires that run out to a switch (or other signal) that you can mount someplace else. (Hacker note: you can take a little PIC and wire it up to P1 and P2 start buttons and have it assert NMI after pressing and holding the buttons down for 3 seconds or something.) There's also a place for wires for a reset switch. If I get it done in time I'll include a new game. :-) It's just "Breakout", but might be kinda neat... I'll post updates to the menu system as any improvements happen. You can burn your own 27C040's or 27C080's, or I'll burn them for you for a few bucks and shipping. If anyone wants it, you can have the source to the menu system too if you want to roll your own. (I can make a menu system for the 27C080 that includes all the cracked but unmodified versions as well-- the 27C080 is just too expensive to buy a whole bunch of at once for putting on every board...) The Daughtercard has two latches: 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0 Latch0: y y y y [--BANK--] Latch1: x x x x x x x x Latch 0 serves as a bank select register for the EPROM. The upper four bits (yyyy) output an active positive "select" bit that can be used to control some relays or whatever for choosing a sound card. (0001 = USB, 0010 = Eliminator, 0100 = Space Fury, 1000 = Zektor) Latch 1 is reserved as a "video expansion" latch. Basically it's an output port that controls a little video adapter card that provides software controlled width and height adjustment and screen "rotation" (for tac/scan). The hardware/software isn't done yet. Both latches come out to a 20 pin .1" dual header if you want to experiment with anything. Like... + 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0 = + 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0 = Top row is latch 0, bottom row is latch 1. = is ground, + is +5Vdc. That's it for now. E-mail if you want one! -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 13:23:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:23:06 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Major Havoc To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 14:28:29 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "Clay Cowgill" at Nov 11, 97 11:46:59 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <3468cdfd0.2d46@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 786 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > > >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) > > Yep. Two layer, pretty simple. Main problem there is that it's physically > a pretty large PCB. Just be kinda expensive to make. Actually there are two varieties of quad pokeys floating around. There is the board with 4 pokeys (40-pin socketed) on it. There is also another version where atari turned out a tiny little board with 4 blobs on it (each blob is a pokey die directly attached to the board).. I prefer the "big" version because it is fixable.. :) Kurt /* * This version of Kurt Mahan is currently being evaluated. Words he speaks * are those of him only and not those of Novell or anybody else. * * Novell Java Technologies R&D Group * * Kurt Mahan * kmahan@novell.com */ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 14:03:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 14:02:40 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 14:03:32 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Major Havoc Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >> >> >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) >> >> Yep. Two layer, pretty simple. Main problem there is that it's physically >> a pretty large PCB. Just be kinda expensive to make. > >Actually there are two varieties of quad pokeys floating around. > >There is the board with 4 pokeys (40-pin socketed) on it. There is also >another version where atari turned out a tiny little board with 4 blobs >on it (each blob is a pokey die directly attached to the board).. I prefer >the "big" version because it is fixable.. :) Kurt's right-- Atari had problems with production of the chip-on-board (die-on-board) version at first so the Quad Pokey eliminator PCB was designed and used (mostly?) on Major Havoc. The Return of the Jedi game has the actual Quad Pokey, as did most Fire Foxes I've run across. I dunno what else had them... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 15:09:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 15:09:20 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client mothost.mot.com, sender jenison@cig.mot.com ) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:08:43 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9711111708.ZM28262@calcite> In-Reply-To: Clay Cowgill "Sega Multigame (Finally!)" (Nov 11, 12:13pm) References: <199711112030.PAA08652@po_box.cig.mot.com> X-face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Multigame (Finally!) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Nov 11, 12:13pm, Clay Cowgill wrote: > Subject: Sega Multigame (Finally!) > Finally! > > Ready to roll on the Sega Multigame! I took a prototype over to a friend's > house and removed his EPROM card and CPU board and popped the whole thing > into a "real" G-80 system. Works like a charm! Found a couple software > glitches (a visual one and a control one) but have those fixed now. > > All "production" parts are verified and the schematic is in OrCAD Capture. > I've outputted the netlist and routed a two-layer board with OrCAD Layout > Plus. I'll double check the netlist against the prototype and send off for > boards probably early next week (or late this week maybe). > > So... I'm going to order about 16-20 boards. Now's the time for a real > headcount on this one. > > I'll sell the kit to people on this list for $75. That includes the > daughtercard (assembled), instructions, a replacement PROM, and the > associated software (on the daughtercard). I'm going to pay Dave Fish a > royalty on each card to say "thanks" for getting the copy-protection > cracked for us. I'm also keeping a cut on these for my time on the menu > system and all the software patches to make the games play from a universal > control panel. > > If you want one (or more than one) please send me a note to: clay@supra.com > > I don't want to get too many extras, but I don't want to get too few either. > If you've already sent me a note saying you wanted a board(s) please send > it again-- the first request was just to gauge interest level. > > I'll probably sell any spares over in RGVAM for $100 a pop. (For some > reason it seems like my "tech support" level goes up dramatically when > "kits" go to people outside of this group of people... ;-) > > Oh, Al-- your's is free for the EPROMs and pulling all the programming info > together. ;-) Hi all, As you probably all know, I've got plenty of spare CPU boards which I'd like to get rid of. At one time I went through them and tested them all, but they've been moved around so much that I can't guarantee they still work (but they probably do). Box of 10 CPU boards for $50 sound fair? (Misc security chips, mostly Space Fury). Heck, at the least you'd have 10 Z-80's and 40 2114 RAMs per box; that's worth something :-) Box of 30 XY pair, untested, no ribbon cables, make offer Box of 20 speech boards, untested/unpopulated, make offer (Might as well get rid of this stuff now before Clay makes a single board multigame and this stuff becomes entirely obsolete...) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 15:27:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 15:27:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <3468E769.6F21@links.magenta.com> Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 16:16:57 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Major Havoc References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Clay Cowgill wrote: > > >> > >> >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) > >> > >> Yep. Two layer, pretty simple. Main problem there is that it's physically > >> a pretty large PCB. Just be kinda expensive to make. > > > >Actually there are two varieties of quad pokeys floating around. > > > >There is the board with 4 pokeys (40-pin socketed) on it. There is also > >another version where atari turned out a tiny little board with 4 blobs > >on it (each blob is a pokey die directly attached to the board).. I prefer > >the "big" version because it is fixable.. :) > > Kurt's right-- Atari had problems with production of the chip-on-board > (die-on-board) version at first so the Quad Pokey eliminator PCB was > designed and used (mostly?) on Major Havoc. The Return of the Jedi game > has the actual Quad Pokey, as did most Fire Foxes I've run across. I dunno > what else had them... I thought that the quad pokey eliminator was used because the quad pokey IC was not done with manufacturing yet? The eliminator (big PCB) was only used on Major Havoc whereas the custom IC was used on RotJ and Firefox (as Clay said) but both of them came out after Major Havoc. I actually prefer the small custom IC since it doesn't cover all IC's within 1" of it. :=0 Off topic: anyone going to Pin Expo? I will have a booth for "The Game Spot" there. See ya' there! jess -- Jess M. Askey ************* My Page *************** ESLB/The Audio Analyst * http://magenta.com/havoc * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B **********Pins/Vids For Sale ******** Laramie WY 82070 * http://magenta.com/havoc/game-spot * From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 15:31:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 15:31:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 15:32:27 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega Multigame FAQ Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Getting some pretty good questions, so I think I'll just reply to all and make a running "FAQ" that I'll put on my webpage. Q) Your card replaces the cpu board. So will this make the board cages a bit more reliable? A) Point of clarification-- it doesn't actually replace the CPU board. It plugs into the CPU board. It *does* replace the entire EPROM board. The EPROM board is loaded with old hot-running EPROMs, so the whole thing should run cooler. Far fewer components to go bad too, so I would expect overall system reliability to increase at least a bit. Q) I am having a HARD time finding a Tac/Scan or Star Treck CP, could a tempest spinner work without afecting game play ? A) It should work pretty closely. The number of slots are different though, so the Tempest spinner should rotate faster for an equal number of turns. (That could make Zektor pretty zippy...) You'll still need a "Single Player Control Interface" board to use the spinner though. I don't have one of these myself so I was thinking about making a couple. Let me know if any of you would like one... I also have a PIC microcontroller that acts as a general-purpose "spinner" interface (so one wheel can "talk" Sega G-80, Atari, Omega Race, and TRON/MCRII formats)-- again, let me know if I should make it available. Q) Will the self test be availble for each game ? A) Right now, no. There's nothing technically prohibiting it, but it's pretty tedious patching the self-test code and it adds quite a bit of code to the multi-game menu. (I only have about 512 bytes left without playing some tricks.) The daughtercard runs the Star Trek self test which will test the RAM, Video system, multipliers, spinner, all buttons, and Universal Sound Board. If people are really worried about testing the other sound boards I can probably cobble something together, but I'll make it available on the web later for those that want it. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 15:45:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 15:44:02 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971111174533.00926b80@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:45:34 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Major Havoc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Ye wise ones ... Thanks all for answering my questions!! I was pretty sure of the answers, I just wanted to ask the experts. Now I just have to put an Amplifone in my tempest, and fab a quad pokey board :( Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 16:18:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 16:18:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Major Havoc To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:30:10 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19971111174533.00926b80@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> from "Mit Matelske" at Nov 11, 97 05:45:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <3468f8930.33fc@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 564 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > Thanks all for answering my questions!! I was pretty sure of the > answers, I just wanted to ask the experts. Now I just have to > put an Amplifone in my tempest, and fab a quad pokey board :( If you actually lay out a board for a Quad Pokey let me know -- I'd like to buy several (don't need the parts, just the boards..) Kurt /* * This version of Kurt Mahan is currently being evaluated. Words he speaks * are those of him only and not those of Novell or anybody else. * * Novell Java Technologies R&D Group * * Kurt Mahan * kmahan@novell.com */ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 16:32:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 16:32:25 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34691366.885@erols.com> Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:24:38 -0800 From: Kev X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) References: <3.0.32.19971111092730.00958460@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Okay if we are talking deadbeats..... Jack Shields, SHEL93@aol.com or VDOJAQ@aol.com owes me a Devil Fish PCB and a Mayday Marquee for over 1 year now as the results of a very favorable trade for him (I sent him 2 Galaga boots, one reportedly bad and a nice DK control panel). DVegro@aol.com, owes me a Galaxian repair manual part 2, and the Pac Man troubleshooting part 2 manual for several months now. John Roesner , owe me Dog Patch schematics, Midway 8080 Troubleshooting manuals, for several months now. -- Kev http://www.erols.com/mowerman <- Coin Op Video Game site REMOVE "?" FROM MY E-MAIL Looking for any Pac Man info & a few good PCBs... From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 16:55:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 16:55:43 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34691AFB.39E2@mail.idt.net> Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:56:59 -0800 From: mayday19 X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Major Havoc References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Jeff Hendrix wrote: > > >A couple of questions : > > > >1 . What all does the "quad pokey" daughterboard do? I got a MH boardset > > yesterday without it. > > The Quad pokey board is for the sound effects. it also controls the game's inputs.. > > > >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) > > I don't think it would be too hard to dupe. if I remember right, there are > only 4 pokey chips on it and nothing else (I'll double check tonight) only 4 pokeys.. probably be easier to make one than trying to find a quad-POKEY. they are only found on I,Robot and Firefox boards.. I'd hook you up with one cheap as I have about 10 Firefox boardsets, but they are 1500 miles away :( > >3 . What all does the tempest->mh adapter do (once again, no schematics yet) > > The adapter allows a mh bs to plug directly into a tempest. It also >moves > the x & y adjustment pots to the adapter (the pots on the main pcb are > disabled). I think it might also compensate for pincushioning on a wells > monitor. it does compensate for the pincushoning the WG monitor gets. MH is designed to be used with an amplifone, and to use the adapter boards most of the output circuitry is byassed and send straight into the adapter board thorough jumpers on unused connectors on the game PCB. > You can just wire up a new harness and just forget about the adapter and > everything should work ok (the dedicated hm had no adapter) you can, but you will get pincusioning, not really all that annoying, I wired a MH in a tempest cab once when the adapter board I had at the time broke.. it doesn't look that bad. if you need manuals, I have about 3 copies left of the complete MH manual set, including the conversion manauls and the ammendums. $13 ppd. good quality double-sided copies with a color cover for the main MH manual. also have a few Quantum copies left too.. Jeff -- http://idt.net/~mayday19 From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 17:11:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:11:49 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:58:12 -0600 Subject: Quad POKEY db Message-ID: <19971111.190654.10110.0.gonzothegreat@juno.com> References: <3468f8930.33fc@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-3,5-7 From: gonzothegreat@juno.com (Alan J McCormick) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com A few years back I used a copy of EasyTrax (a freeware DOS PCB layout app) to copy the 4xPOKEY db. I never got around to etching a copy because I got a MH with a DB from Kurt in trade for a Blaster stick :) If anybody wants an untested PCB layout for the DB, I can dig it up from my backups in the next day or two. Virtu-Al From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 17:27:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:27:40 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:28:26 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Marks G-80 parts... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com If any of you pick up the 30 vector boards from Mark I'd like to get a set (or two-- untested is fine) since my spare is dead and I plan on working on G-80 stuff for a little while longer at least. ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 17:30:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:30:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:29:57 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Marks G-80 parts... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com 30 are too many sets for me, too... why not break it into smaller lots? I would go for 5 or 6 sets for $100 or so. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 11 17:42:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:42:41 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:43:39 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: ESB stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi all. Ran across something "new" yesterday. I had sold a "new style" ESB kit to someone that couldn't get it to work, so after swapping it out (for another fully tested kit) to no avail I agreed to take a look at it if he sent it to me. I got the boardset and somewhat to my suprise I found that it's a DIFFERENT CPU board than the rest I'd seen. This one is a Rev "A" board (in the 20 or 30 Star Wars boards I've worked on I've never seen a Rev "A" before). The only obvious difference is that the motherboard has been hand modified to allow the 27128 (1F or 1M, don't recall)-- pin 26 has been isolated from the +5 rail and a long blue jumper-wire was added to pick up the address line from somewhere. I only mention this because all attempts by me to get the ESB kit installed in this thing have failed. Something weird is going on and I can't quite see it yet. Just bizarre. The game starts just fine, but then resets at the beginning of the game play with ESB. The other "odd" bit is that the PCB has the serial number sticker which suggests something in the middle of the production run-- UR005xxx. Go figure. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 01:10:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:10:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34696E8A.1C12FB21@telis.org> Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 00:53:31 -0800 From: Bill Esquivel X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Major Havoc References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Are the quad pokeys on firefox and ROTJ as the one on MH? I have a weird looking quad pokey. Instead of the board socket being in the middle, this one is off in the corner. The 4 chips are all in a row. on the front it says a041774 atari 83 on the back it says 041775-01 pct f 084 any ideas? Clay Cowgill wrote: > >> > >> >2 . Would it be easy to duplicate (haven't downloaded the schematics yet) > >> > >> Yep. Two layer, pretty simple. Main problem there is that it's physically > >> a pretty large PCB. Just be kinda expensive to make. > > > >Actually there are two varieties of quad pokeys floating around. > > > >There is the board with 4 pokeys (40-pin socketed) on it. There is also > >another version where atari turned out a tiny little board with 4 blobs > >on it (each blob is a pokey die directly attached to the board).. I prefer > >the "big" version because it is fixable.. :) > > Kurt's right-- Atari had problems with production of the chip-on-board > (die-on-board) version at first so the Quad Pokey eliminator PCB was > designed and used (mostly?) on Major Havoc. The Return of the Jedi game > has the actual Quad Pokey, as did most Fire Foxes I've run across. I dunno > what else had them... > > -Clay > > Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager > _______________________________________________________________________ > /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com > \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 05:30:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 05:29:49 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:29:18 -0500 (EST) From: Dangerwil@aol.com Message-ID: <971112082917_2037778031@mrin39> To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Multigame (Finally!) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In a message dated 97-11-11 19:41:48 EST, you write: > ll "production" parts are verified and the schematic is in OrCAD Capture. > I've outputted the netlist and routed a two-layer board with OrCAD Layout > Plus. I'll double check the netlist against the prototype and send off for > boards probably early next week (or late this week maybe). > Clay, Please put me down for 1 complete, Sega Multigame kit. I will send you a MO for $75 in a couple of days. Thanks, Bill From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 05:41:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 05:41:36 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:40:58 -0500 (EST) From: Dangerwil@aol.com Message-ID: <971112084058_1404364529@mrin84.mail.aol.com> To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Multigame (Finally!) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com OOPS , the reply button strike again, WAKE UP> From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 08:01:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:00:53 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: From: "Ozdemir, Steve" To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: RE: Sega Multigame (Finally!) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:00:23 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com G'day Mark, I might be interested in some back ups. Sure I have five sets now, but 10 years from now, I'd probably appreciate having some "possibly working" parts to swap in. How about breaking it up into several sets, Mark? Steven S Ozdemir sso@dsc.com >---------- >From: Mark Jenison[SMTP:jenison@cig.mot.com] >Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 1997 3:08 PM >To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Subject: Re: Sega Multigame (Finally!) > >On Nov 11, 12:13pm, Clay Cowgill wrote: >> Subject: Sega Multigame (Finally!) >> Finally! >> >> Ready to roll on the Sega Multigame! I took a prototype over to a friend's >> house and removed his EPROM card and CPU board and popped the whole thing >> into a "real" G-80 system. Works like a charm! Found a couple software >> glitches (a visual one and a control one) but have those fixed now. >> >> All "production" parts are verified and the schematic is in OrCAD Capture. >> I've outputted the netlist and routed a two-layer board with OrCAD Layout >> Plus. I'll double check the netlist against the prototype and send off for >> boards probably early next week (or late this week maybe). >> >> So... I'm going to order about 16-20 boards. Now's the time for a real >> headcount on this one. >> >> I'll sell the kit to people on this list for $75. That includes the >> daughtercard (assembled), instructions, a replacement PROM, and the >> associated software (on the daughtercard). I'm going to pay Dave Fish a >> royalty on each card to say "thanks" for getting the copy-protection >> cracked for us. I'm also keeping a cut on these for my time on the menu >> system and all the software patches to make the games play from a universal >> control panel. >> >> If you want one (or more than one) please send me a note to: clay@supra.com >> >> I don't want to get too many extras, but I don't want to get too few >>either. >> If you've already sent me a note saying you wanted a board(s) please send >> it again-- the first request was just to gauge interest level. >> >> I'll probably sell any spares over in RGVAM for $100 a pop. (For some >> reason it seems like my "tech support" level goes up dramatically when >> "kits" go to people outside of this group of people... ;-) >> >> Oh, Al-- your's is free for the EPROMs and pulling all the programming info >> together. ;-) > >Hi all, > >As you probably all know, I've got plenty of spare CPU boards which I'd like >to >get rid of. At one time I went through them and tested them all, but they've >been moved around so much that I can't guarantee they still work (but they >probably do). > >Box of 10 CPU boards for $50 sound fair? (Misc security chips, mostly Space >Fury). Heck, at the least you'd have 10 Z-80's and 40 2114 RAMs per box; >that's worth something :-) > >Box of 30 XY pair, untested, no ribbon cables, make offer > >Box of 20 speech boards, untested/unpopulated, make offer > >(Might as well get rid of this stuff now before Clay makes a single board >multigame and this stuff becomes entirely obsolete...) > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- >Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com >Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 08:17:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:17:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:16:27 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9711121016.ZM9805@calcite> In-Reply-To: aek@motgate.mot.com (Al Kossow) "Re: Marks G-80 parts..." (Nov 11, 5:29pm) References: <199711120139.UAA02942@po_box.cig.mot.com> X-Face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Marks G-80 parts... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Nov 11, 5:29pm, Al Kossow wrote: > Subject: Re: Marks G-80 parts... > 30 are too many sets for me, too... > > why not break it into smaller lots? I would go for 5 or 6 > sets for $100 or so. Ok, I can go for smaller lots. 5 XY pair (10 boards total), untested, no ribbon cables for $50 + S&H sound fair? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 08:30:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:29:57 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:31:04 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Major Havoc Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Are the quad pokeys on firefox and ROTJ as the one on MH? I have a weird >looking >quad pokey. Instead of the board socket being in the middle, this one is off in >the corner. The 4 chips are all in a row. Hmmmm. Sounds like Atari might have done a couple of board spins for different physical requirements... From my *huge* ;-) sample of about 3 RoJ and FireFox boards they all had the chip-on-board version of the quad Pokey. About the same physical size as a 40 pin dip, four little blobs (chip dies) covered with black epoxy on top. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 08:44:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:44:16 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:43:35 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711121643.LAA09936@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In-reply-to: <971112084058_1404364529@mrin84.mail.aol.com> (Dangerwil@aol.com) Subject: New to list, Amplifone questions Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi Guys, I'm new to this vector list and would really like to get it in digest form as it seems really busy. Is this possible? Anyway, I have an amplifone questions: I recently got an amplifone HV board (a white, rev 2 board) for my dead star wars monitor. I was told that the board tested good (with an hv probe, not in a working monitor) and it came from someone on rgvac that I have dealt with before and trust. Anyway, the board arrived with a broken lead (aparently happened in shipping) where one of the large resistors had been jumpered. There are also other modifications to this board that include the addtion of two diodes on the solder side of the board. I can provide more details if necessary. I was wondering if anyone knows of a modification to this board that includes the elimination of the large resistor at the top left corner of the board (as you look at it with the heat sink on top and the HV trans on the right, I would provide the location marking from the board but it is too burnt to read). This board does look like it has been factory serviced (it has several service/tested stickers that my original HV board does not have). I will add that, while the other mods to the board seem to be cleanly done, the jumper wire is a mess: Somone clipped the resistor on one side, then desoldered the other side. The jumper was then soldered to the old resistor lead on one side and to the board on the other. Its quite a mess. One more thing the two boards have different HV transformers though both are red. I figure that I need to either replace the broken jumper wire but I hesitate to do so if this is not a known modification to this board. Maybe I should just restor it to its original configuration. Any help with this board would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Dan Rasmussen dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 08:46:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:45:59 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:45:57 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: New to list, Amplifone questions Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "I'm new to this vector list and would really like to get it in digest form as it seems really busy. Is this possible?" All of the messages are archived on www.spies.com/arcade/vectorlist by month. There is no digest. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 09:04:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 09:04:17 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:03:45 -0600 (CST) From: jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: New to list, Amplifone questions In-Reply-To: <199711121643.LAA09936@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 12 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > I will add that, while the other mods to the board seem to be cleanly > done, the jumper wire is a mess: Somone clipped the resistor on one > side, then desoldered the other side. The jumper was then soldered to > the old resistor lead on one side and to the board on the other. Its > quite a mess. It sounds like it... > One more thing the two boards have different HV transformers though > both are red. This is wierd...I have only seen one type of red HV transformer... > I figure that I need to either replace the broken jumper wire but I > hesitate to do so if this is not a known modification to this board. > Maybe I should just restor it to its original configuration. > I would strongly suggest restoring it to its original configuration. A recent example of why you should do so is that I had a Black Widow which was getting no HV (in its WG color XY monitor) so I pulled the HV board and took a look. It literally looked like the thing tore itself apart. Transistors were blown apart, resistors burned, and I noticed that one of the "non-standard" (i.e. Not available at Radio Shack, but easily available from my local electronics store) resistors was replaced by some frankensteined mess of power resistors in parallel. First thing I did was pull all that crap out, test the flyback using Clay's little chart, and replace a bunch of components with their proper replacements. I fired it up and it worked like a charm. I am aware of only one modification on the HV board of the Amplifone -- It's changing a resistor value from 2.2k to 1k (I think it's R12? This is covered in Gregg's FAQ, though, and I think it's supposed to be done when you replace the HV transformer.) The diodes might be there because someone replaced the BU406D with a BU406. You should restore the board to its original condition, whether the board works or not. That's just my opinion. Any operator hacks, even if they're not giving you problems now, will probably give you headaches in the future... Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 09:25:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 09:25:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:24:29 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9711121124.ZM11710@calcite> In-Reply-To: Kev "Re: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list)" (Nov 11, 6:24pm) References: <3.0.32.19971111092730.00958460@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> <199711120041.TAA29573@po_box.cig.mot.com> X-Face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Nov 11, 6:24pm, Kev wrote: > Subject: Re: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) > Okay if we are talking deadbeats..... > > Jack Shields, SHEL93@aol.com or VDOJAQ@aol.com owes me a Devil Fish PCB and a Mayday > Marquee for over 1 year now as the results of a very favorable trade for him (I sent him > 2 Galaga boots, one reportedly bad and a nice DK control panel). Well, Jack is from around my area and I've dealt with him before. He went through a divorce about a year ago so that tends to screw things up. No excuse, but tends to change priorities a bit...anyway, he may show up and Rick's Expo Party tonight so if I see him I'll see what's going on. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 09:46:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 09:46:48 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971112114830.009569d0@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:48:33 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Quad POKEY db Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 06:58 PM 11/11/97 -0600, you wrote: >A few years back I used a copy of EasyTrax (a freeware DOS PCB layout >app) to copy the 4xPOKEY db. I never got around to etching a copy because >I got a MH with a DB from Kurt in trade for a Blaster stick :) > >If anybody wants an untested PCB layout for the DB, I can dig it up from >my backups in the next day or two. > >Virtu-Al > This is something I have never done before, so how involved, and expensive is it to do a very small ( < 5 ) pcb run? I guess I am kinda directing this at Clay, as it seems he would have the most experience doing this. And, if I could come up with the cash, could someone guide me through creating whatever I need to make the run? Many thanks, Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 09:54:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 09:54:37 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971112115622.0095a430@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:56:23 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Follow up (Re: deadbeat list) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 06:24 PM 11/11/97 -0800, you wrote: >Okay if we are talking deadbeats..... > >Jack Shields, SHEL93@aol.com or VDOJAQ@aol.com owes me a Devil Fish PCB and a Mayday >Marquee for over 1 year now as the results of a very favorable trade for him (I sent him >2 Galaga boots, one reportedly bad and a nice DK control panel). > >DVegro@aol.com, owes me a Galaxian repair manual part 2, and the Pac Man troubleshooting >part 2 manual for several months now. > >John Roesner , owe me Dog Patch schematics, Midway 8080 >Troubleshooting manuals, for several months now. >-- >Kev http://www.erols.com/mowerman <- Coin Op Video Game site > >REMOVE "?" FROM MY E-MAIL > Looking for any Pac Man info & a few good PCBs... > > > I've dealt with dave (dvegro) before, and saying he was slow would be an understatement, but he always kept in touch and DID eventually deliver all my goods in very acceptable condition. Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 10:02:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:02:53 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:02:49 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: short-run PCB fabs Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "This is something I have never done before, so how involved, and expensive is it to do a very small ( < 5 ) pcb run? I guess I am kinda directing this at Clay, as it seems he would have the most experience doing this." well.. Clay posted that his company was getting a short run PC fab setup, wonder if it's here yet :-) There is also a company in Canada that specializes in quick turn protos that is all web/email based. You send them the photoplots, and they send you back boards. I haven't been able to find their web adr this morning, though.. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 10:17:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:17:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: Message-Id: <9711121816.AA24032@savage.raleigh.ibm.com> Subject: Re: Quad POKEY db To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 13:16:34 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19971112114830.009569d0@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> from "Mit Matelske" at Nov 12, 97 11:48:33 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1486 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com With the output from Protel EasyTrax, getting a run of PCBs done is no big deal. APCircuits in Alberta, Canada (www.apcircuits.com) can take your data files, create the boards, and ship 'em out to you in something like a day (as long as your data files are good). The price should be in the $100 range depending on the size of the board. At least that was the price range for the 10 ESB PCBs I did. John > At 06:58 PM 11/11/97 -0600, you wrote: > >A few years back I used a copy of EasyTrax (a freeware DOS PCB layout > >app) to copy the 4xPOKEY db. I never got around to etching a copy because > >I got a MH with a DB from Kurt in trade for a Blaster stick :) > > > >If anybody wants an untested PCB layout for the DB, I can dig it up from > >my backups in the next day or two. > > > >Virtu-Al > > > > This is something I have never done before, so how involved, and expensive > is it to do a very small ( < 5 ) pcb run? I guess I am kinda directing > this at Clay, as it seems he would have the most experience doing this. > > And, if I could come up with the cash, could someone guide me through > creating whatever I need to make the run? > > Many thanks, > > Mit > +-------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | John W. Linville To Be, Rather Than To Seem. | | linvjw@vnet.ibm.com I will not torment the emotionally frail... :-) | +-------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 10:36:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:36:12 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:37:00 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Quad POKEY db Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >This is something I have never done before, so how involved, and expensive >is it to do a very small ( < 5 ) pcb run? I guess I am kinda directing >this at Clay, as it seems he would have the most experience doing this. How involved: Depends. If the design is small (four chips and a plug) it's not bad at all. You do have to know what you're doing though. PCB manufacturing has its own lingo and issues. www.apcircuits.com (they're in Canada-- you'll see that a lot NAFTA reasons) has a good "starter course" for picking up the basics. That's pretty much how I learned (and I sat across the wall from our PCB guys for about a year). It's pretty tedious the first time, and depending on the quality of your tools it can be almost impossible depending on what you're trying to do. For all the ESB stuff I used the free EasyTrax and GCpreview and it worked fine. Took a while to get the board right with EasyTrax, and I still had an "oops" on the Version 2.0 ESB boards because I got careless. For the Sega Multigame I actually used OrCAD's "real" tools because I was going from a schematic and I wanted the auto-router to do most of the PCB work... Expense: Depends. You should be able to do 5 boards about 3x5" each for around $20 each. You pay based on some setup charges and square inches so it pays to keep things small. If you wanted soldermask and silk screen on those it'd be more like $80 a pop. (That's not bad at all-- we'll spend upwards of $300-400 PER BOARD to do a "professional" quality prototype ISA card. That includes electrical testing and 8 mil track widths and track-to-track spacing though too...) >And, if I could come up with the cash, could someone guide me through >creating whatever I need to make the run? www.apcircuits.com does a good job of that. Just quadruple check your work-- you want to get it right the first time. -Clay (tip-- when you can, "piggy back" other projects on the same board and just cut them apart with a Dremel or hack-saw. You save the big setup charges that way. The Sega Multigame includes a little PCB to "jumper" the Security Chip socket that I'll just cut off the fab prior to shipping...) Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 10:37:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 10:37:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: New to list, Amplifone questions Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 18:39:55 GMT Message-ID: <346cf55f.65839879@tommy.doctord.com> References: <199711121643.LAA09936@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> In-Reply-To: <199711121643.LAA09936@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:43:35 -0500 (EST), Dan Rasmussen wrote: > >Hi Guys, > >I'm new to this vector list and would really like to get it >in digest form as it seems really busy. Is this possible? > >Anyway, I have an amplifone questions: > >I recently got an amplifone HV board (a white, rev 2 board) for my=20 >dead star wars monitor. I was told that the board tested good (with=20 >an hv probe, not in a working monitor) and it came from someone on >rgvac that I have dealt with before and trust. Anyway, the board >arrived with a broken lead (aparently happened in shipping) where one=20 >of the large resistors had been jumpered. There are also other=20 >modifications to this board that include the addtion of two diodes=20 >on the solder side of the board. I can provide more details if=20 >necessary. > >I was wondering if anyone knows of a modification to this board=20 >that includes the elimination of the large resistor at the top left >corner of the board (as you look at it with the heat sink on top and >the HV trans on the right, I would provide the location marking from >the board but it is too burnt to read). This board does look like it=20 >has been factory serviced (it has several service/tested stickers that=20 >my original HV board does not have). =20 > >I will add that, while the other mods to the board seem to be cleanly=20 >done, the jumper wire is a mess: Somone clipped the resistor on one=20 >side, then desoldered the other side. The jumper was then soldered to=20 >the old resistor lead on one side and to the board on the other. Its=20 >quite a mess. > >One more thing the two boards have different HV transformers though=20 >both are red. =20 > >I figure that I need to either replace the broken jumper wire but I >hesitate to do so if this is not a known modification to this board. >Maybe I should just restor it to its original configuration. The diodes are legit, I have three (or four?) amplifone boards and they all have factory installed mods that include a couple of diodes. I haven't looked at the schematic, but I imagine they bypass the regulators to keep them from blowing during power up/down transitions. Also added to the HV section of all amplifones are a couple of 50 ohm power (3 or 5 watt I think) resistors that are connected across the voltage regulators. These were added to supply the additional current needed during the explosion scenes in Star Wars, where the screen goes white. During the explosion HV regulation will suffer, but hell it's an explosion, who cares if the screen jumps around a bit? If it is one of these resistors that was bypassed, then loose the jumper. It probably indicates the regulator died and this was a shlock job at trying to get the board going without replacing the regulator. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 12:43:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 12:43:23 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:42:44 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: short-run PCB fabs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com With all this talk about fab-ing PCBs, I'm surprised that no one mentioned doing it at home. The guy who sits next to me here downloaded a PS file with a PCB layout on it, xeroxed it on a sheet of that iron-on resist stuff, and etched it with etchant from Radio Shack, I believe. It turned out better than we both expected. The only limit is on the minimum size of the traces. I think it has to be relatively large (like the size of power/ground traces on video game PCBs.) BUT, looking at Clay's ESB layout, for instance, I think it would be possible to do that at home -- it would just take a bigger board. Not having seen a Quad-Pokey board, I can't even guess if it's possible, but I'm thinking of making my Cine. Exorcisor board this way. Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------ Joseph J. Welser jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu Design Engineer -- Crystal Semiconductor Corporation Ph.D. Student in E.E. -- University of Texas at Austin Work: jwelser@crystal.cirrus.com http://www.crystal.com P.O. Box 17847; Austin, TX 78760 ------------------------------------------------------------------ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 13:17:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 13:17:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <346A394E.34F1@mail.idt.net> Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 15:18:38 -0800 From: mayday19 X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ESB stuff... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > I only mention this because all attempts by me to get the ESB kit installed > in this thing have failed. Something weird is going on and I can't quite > see it yet. Just bizarre. The game starts just fine, but then resets at > the beginning of the game play with ESB. I had this same thing happen to my ESB UR machine. It is an original atari kit, but when I got it, it would come up and work fine in attract mode, and when you would start a game the machine would reset. the problem was the ROMs on the daughter board were bad. I dont know what the board Rev. is though.. I have to go look at it today anyway so I will see what kinda board it has. I got a sevice call on it (yes, I operate it) saying the game puts big bright white lines on the screen every so often and the monitor is getting dimmer. doesn't sound good to me! Jeff -- http://idt.net/~mayday19 From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 13:29:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 13:29:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <346A214B.505@an.hp.com> Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:36:11 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: short-run PCB fabs References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > > With all this talk about fab-ing PCBs, I'm surprised that > no one mentioned doing it at home. The guy who sits next to me > here downloaded a PS file with a PCB layout on it, xeroxed it on > a sheet of that iron-on resist stuff, and etched it with etchant from > Radio Shack, I believe. It turned out better than we both expected. > > The only limit is on the minimum size of the traces. I think > it has to be relatively large (like the size of power/ground traces > on video game PCBs.) > > BUT, looking at Clay's ESB layout, for instance, I think > it would be possible to do that at home -- it would just take a > bigger board. Not having seen a Quad-Pokey board, I can't even > guess if it's possible, but I'm thinking of making my Cine. > Exorcisor board this way. > I've done this at home, just like this. I've had mixed results. The biggest problem for me at least, was drilling the holes accurately so that you could actually fit a 40 pin IC on the board without bending the pins every which way. If you are stuffing the board with small IC's, or discreet components, the alignment issue is not much of a problem at all. Now that I have a milling machine, I can strap PCB's to the XY table and machine the holes to within 0.001 inch tolerances. But, I imagine that for most home setups, the drilling step is going to be a continual challenge. I too found that the line widths had to be large for the iron on transfer stuff. I guess a little experimentation is in order to figure out what you can and cannot do with your particular equipment and methodologies. Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 13:57:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 13:56:51 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 13:58:02 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: short-run PCB fabs Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > With all this talk about fab-ing PCBs, I'm surprised that >no one mentioned doing it at home. The guy who sits next to me >here downloaded a PS file with a PCB layout on it, xeroxed it on >a sheet of that iron-on resist stuff, and etched it with etchant from >Radio Shack, I believe. It turned out better than we both expected. I have a bunch of this stuff and haven't tried it yet. I hear different stories from different people. The mix is more negative than positive from the guys I know... > The only limit is on the minimum size of the traces. I think >it has to be relatively large (like the size of power/ground traces >on video game PCBs.) There are some more gotcha's-- 1) You need a good dark toner print on the sheet. Photocopiers don't do that too well. New laserprinter cartridges work well though. ;-) 2) The result is only as good as you can get the toner-transfer to stick to the PCB. Some people can do it with an iron, or you can get one of those modified desktop laminators (for ~$150). 3) Trace widths vary with your skill at the process (chemicals used, temp of etchant, etc.). I guy I knew in college did 8 mil traces pretty regularly at home, but just using the photo-resist stuff in a home-darkroom. 4) Holes. Drill your own. You have to balance "size of pad vs. size of drill bit" and have sharp drill bits or you'll rip the traces off the fiberglass. Alignment is annoying as all hell too-- it REALLY helps if you leave the center of the IC pad with a "hole" in the pattern. Most (modern) PCB routing software doesn't do that by default, but having the hole gives the drill bit a place to center. 5) Holes. Not plated through-- you'll need to run wire through for vias, and make sure chips are soldered topside and bottomside if the nets connect on both pads. 6) No plating. You'll have to buy something like TINIT to tin the copper on the PCB or it'll oxidize and be really tough to solder on (and look like hell). > BUT, looking at Clay's ESB layout, for instance, I think >it would be possible to do that at home -- it would just take a >bigger board. Not having seen a Quad-Pokey board, I can't even >guess if it's possible, but I'm thinking of making my Cine. >Exorcisor board this way. Yeah, maybe... I run a lot of traces in-between pads with 10 mil spacing and that "freeway" of traces from the 22V10 are 10mils wide with 10mils of space between them. I think the quad-pokey would be easier. It actually looked like 1/8" trace widths (like you'd make with a Radio-Shack dry-transfer kit) to me. For quick-n-dirty a "Sharpie" permanent-ink pen works as an etchant-resist pen. Just draw on the PCB. If you don't care if the traces and parts are on the same side of the PCB you can just "draw" the circuit on. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 14:06:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:06:00 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: short-run PCB fabs Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 22:07:59 GMT Message-ID: <3470231a.77548480@tommy.doctord.com> References: <346A214B.505@an.hp.com> In-Reply-To: <346A214B.505@an.hp.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:36:11 -0500, Joel Rosenzweig wrote: >jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: >>=20 >> With all this talk about fab-ing PCBs, I'm surprised that >> no one mentioned doing it at home. The guy who sits next to me >> here downloaded a PS file with a PCB layout on it, xeroxed it on >> a sheet of that iron-on resist stuff, and etched it with etchant from >> Radio Shack, I believe. It turned out better than we both expected. >>=20 >> The only limit is on the minimum size of the traces. I think >> it has to be relatively large (like the size of power/ground traces >> on video game PCBs.) >>=20 >> BUT, looking at Clay's ESB layout, for instance, I think >> it would be possible to do that at home -- it would just take a >> bigger board. Not having seen a Quad-Pokey board, I can't even >> guess if it's possible, but I'm thinking of making my Cine. >> Exorcisor board this way. >>=20 > >I've done this at home, just like this. I've had mixed results. The >biggest problem for me at least, was drilling the holes accurately so >that you could actually fit a 40 pin IC on the board without bending the >pins every which way. If you are stuffing the board with small IC's, or >discreet components, the alignment issue is not much of a problem at >all. =20 > >Now that I have a milling machine, I can strap PCB's to the XY table and >machine the holes to within 0.001 inch tolerances. But, I imagine that >for most home setups, the drilling step is going to be a continual >challenge. > >I too found that the line widths had to be large for the iron on >transfer stuff. I guess a little experimentation is in order to figure >out what you can and cannot do with your particular equipment and >methodologies. I have a friend that can get incredibly fine traces (He can get *two* traces between a standard IC pin.) He has a few tricks for doing this. #1 He uses one of those rubber heating pads to "heat the board" not the transfer plastic sheet. By heating the PCB to transfer temperatures you don't end up with cold spots where the transfer ink didn't stick. #2 After pressing firmly (I'm not sure if he even uses an iron, I can ask him), making sure everything is transferred, he get some chunks of *ice* and rubs them down the back of the transfer plastic as he peels it off. The transfer ink immediately snaps of the plastic. He ends up with a 100% transfer of the transfer ink to the PCB. It's very effective, by holding up the transfer plastic to a light source you can see there is *no* transfer ink left on the plastic. #3 The chemicals that etch the copper are also heated by wrapping the container in the same "rubber" heating mat stuff, he then uses an aquarium pump to percolate air through the mixture, to allow for continuous stirring of the etchant. #4 Holes are drilled using a small drill press, with the special drills that are 1/8" stock at the top where they go into the chuck, and are then tapered down to the very small sizes needed to drill PCB hole. If you sneeze on these bits, they shatter. I didn't think a home made board could look this nice, but his boards come out looking like a professionally done, single sided board. He also does doubled sided boards, without the plate through holes, obviously. The give away is the hole spacing, he doesn't have a mill, and the holes do end up slightly off at times. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 14:40:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:40:26 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:41:38 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: ESB stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >I had this same thing happen to my ESB UR machine. It is an original >atari kit, but when I got it, it would come up and work fine in attract >mode, and when you would start a game the machine would reset. the >problem was the ROMs on the daughter board were bad. I dont know what the >board Rev. is though.. I tracked it to the daughtercard last night too. Odd though-- I replaced the ROMs and had the same problem. The *extra* weird part is that the same daughtercard works JUST FINE in another CPU board. A different daughtercard in the "problem" boards works just dandy. Gotta be the 22V10 or some bizarre-o combination of manufacturers that is pissing it off. (AMD EPROMs on CPU board + NS EPROMs on daughtercard + AMD PAL22V10... or something) I hate upgrades. ;-) >I have to go look at it today anyway so I will see what kinda board it >has. I got a sevice call on it (yes, I operate it) saying the game puts >big bright white lines on the screen every so often and the monitor is >getting dimmer. doesn't sound good to me! Glitchy Vector Generator board? -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 14:43:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:43:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971112154245.00a23a20@btc.btc.adaptec.com> X-Sender: andersk@btc.btc.adaptec.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 15:42:45 -0700 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Anders Knudsen Subject: Re: short-run PCB fabs In-Reply-To: <3470231a.77548480@tommy.doctord.com> References: <346A214B.505@an.hp.com> <346A214B.505@an.hp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In college I used a quick circuit prototyping machine called QuickCircuit by T-Tech. This machine milled out copper to create traces. We used Protel's schematic capture and PCB layout tools, generated gerber files, then used a cad tool provided by t-tech to isolate traces out. The machine did the isolation with a mill bit, used drill bits of standard sizes for through holes. It can do double sided boards. I did a bunch of school related projects on this thing, and also some personal ones. I prototyped my WG LV redesign using the QuickCircuit. I was able to get down to 5 mil traces with 5 mil spacing using this thing! I would LOVE to have one of these in the workshop at home...however, the thing is a bit expensive. They have a web site, , with pictures and info, etc. It looks like they will send a free sample of a pcb done with their equipment. -Anders. ----------------------------------------- | Anders Knudsen | ASIC Design Engineer | Adaptec, Inc., Boulder Technology Center | anders_knudsen@btc.adaptec.com | http://www.adaptec.com ========================================= From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 12 15:56:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 15:55:31 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 15:56:35 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: short-run PCB fabs Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >In college I used a quick circuit prototyping machine called QuickCircuit >by T-Tech. We had the QuickCircuit in for demo here. The rep couldn't really get it to work reliably, but that's more a function of his inexperience with it... (There's some skill involved in getting the router depth set just right for the trace you want.) We (supposedly) have a competitors unit on order. (I think it's called a "quickproto" or something like that.) I haven't seen it come in yet though, so no news on how well it works... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 14 08:54:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:54:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: From: "Ozdemir, Steve" To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: recap of Tempest Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:53:57 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com G'day folks, Well, I bought some Zanen kits about two years ago, and after digging them (and reading the instructions) I had a question or two. After reading about it enough times hear and in RGVAC, I figured out rather quickly that R104 and R105 on the deflection board schematics were really ZD's. What I couldn't find on my HV board was R913 in the schematics? OK, and I had a question about the parts that Zanen was supplying. I'm not very good at identifying parts, but the differing sizes of the resistors (for 1/4 watt, 1/2 watt and 2 watt) was a dead give away as to which resistor was which. What I couldn't read or figure out was the ZD's. The largest ZD was readable (and meant for ZD902. The next two largest ZD were taped together, so they were probably 1N4750 27V and meant for ZD100 and ZD101? This doesn't seem right since the original ZD100 part had a big black ZD and I'm replacing it with a smaller orange one?? The other ZD that was of similar size was probably 1N4743 and meant for ZD901, right? Finally the smallest two diodes (not ZD's?) were taped together and probably 1N4148 and were meant for D104 and D105? Also, should I replace the POT in the HV? Does this control HV? If so, I have no way of measuring it so I probably should leave it alone. Thanks for any help in confirming my suspicions....as you can see, I'm a bit of a scaried cat in making tech changs without having everything double checked and confirmed by someone else. Thanks in advance! Steven S Ozdemir sso@dsc.com ps - Hey, David Fish, I dug my HP5004A out last night, and it looks complete. So if it powers up (and I can figure a way around the oscilliscope), I think I'll try my hand at repairing some broken Cinematronics mother boards with your EXCELLENT user manual and the repaired Cinematronics Exercisor! If things go real well, then I'll start in on repairing Kurt Mahan's, too! From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 14 09:08:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 09:08:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 11:07:29 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: Re: recap of Tempest In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Ozdemir, Steve wrote: > OK, and I had a question about the parts that Zanen was supplying. I'm > not very good at identifying parts, but the differing sizes of the > resistors (for 1/4 watt, 1/2 watt and 2 watt) was a dead give away as to > which resistor was which. What I couldn't read or figure out was the > ZD's. The largest ZD was readable (and meant for ZD902. The next two > largest ZD were taped together, so they were probably 1N4750 27V and > meant for ZD100 and ZD101? This doesn't seem right since the original > ZD100 part had a big black ZD and I'm replacing it with a smaller orange > one?? That's probably OK. I think the monitor manual specifies "28V Zener Diode" as the replacement for those. The 1N4750s I got to replace them were actually blue in color, and in a different package than the original. So, I wouldn't worry too much. > Thanks for any help in confirming my suspicions....as you can see, I'm a > bit of a scaried cat in making tech changs without having everything > double checked and confirmed by someone else. Thanks in advance! All your other hunches seem OK. I've never installed a Zanen kit on one of those monitors (I just replace what's bad) so I don't know which POT you're referring to... Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 14 12:45:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 12:45:37 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971114123453.008c6920@mail.cris.com> X-Sender: wernst@mail.cris.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 12:34:53 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: "Warren 'Llama' Ernst" Subject: Re: recap of Tempest In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 08:53 AM 11/14/97 -0800, you wrote: >G'day folks, > >Also, should I replace the POT in the HV? Does this control HV? If so, >I have no way of measuring it so I probably should leave it alone. I have recapped 6 WG monitors (a small number for some people here, I'm sure, but its an impressive number to me), and I have never seen the pot on the HV cage go bad, and I now leave it in. Of course, since it is simply a variable resistor, you can remove it from the circuit and measure resistances across the pins, and then twist the new one to match, and THEN put the new one in. I did this the first few cap kits. OF course, this also assumes that the monitor was working pretty OK before the the cap kit, or before someone else started screwing with it. If its setting was screwed up by someone attempting to fix it in the past, then all bets are off. Virtually, Warr ------------------------------+---------------------------------------- Reviewer, "Windows Magazine" | Warren Ernst - warren@techie.com Author, "Using Netscape" | http://www.cris.com/~wernst/ "Internet 1997 Unleashed" (c) | Computer Journalist, Consultant, Author "Netscape 3 Unleashed"(contr) | Graphic Artist, Nerd "Presenting ActiveX" | Que and Sams.Net Publishing | "If it ain't broke, don't break it." ------------------------------+---------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 14 13:47:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:47:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:46:30 -0500 (EST) From: "Christopher X. Candreva" To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: Re: recap of Tempest In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Ozdemir, Steve wrote: > which resistor was which. What I couldn't read or figure out was the > ZD's. The largest ZD was readable (and meant for ZD902. The next two > largest ZD were taped together, so they were probably 1N4750 27V and > meant for ZD100 and ZD101? This doesn't seem right since the original > ZD100 part had a big black ZD and I'm replacing it with a smaller orange > one?? My Zanen kit included a sheet of paper that stated what part numbers were for which part locations (ie: ZD 902). Sounds like you are missing that. If the problem is you can't read the part numbers on the parts -- maybe just a magnifying glass ? I should also mention: Be VERY carefull you don't put the ZD902 part into the D902 socket. This will result in many melted companents. This was the problem I posted about a month or so ago. The broken Tempest I purchased had been bungled in this manner. -Chris ========================================================== Chris Candreva -- chris@westnet.com -- (914) 967-7816 WestNet Internet Services of Westchester http://www.westnet.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sat Nov 15 08:47:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 08:46:54 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Timestamp: 15 Nov 1997 16:46:00 GMT Message-ID: <346DD220.200ADF58@netconx.net> Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 10:47:28 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com" Subject: Sega Q's Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to find one & was wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? If so what what games used them ? I thought about building one using edge card connectors & point to point wiring (not looking forward to all that soldering) but I am concerned if it would be too noisy ? I don't want to alter my space fury cp for Clay's multi game, anyone have somthing to fit the convertab-cab? (poor or damaged overlay ok) Something with a spinner would be nice, but I do have a spare from a tempest. Thanks Todd FWIW: I have changed ISP's old: www.willowtree.com/~litterbox litterbox@willowtree.com good til 11/30/97 new:www.netconx.net/~litterbox litterbox@netconx.net From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sat Nov 15 12:02:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:02:26 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:02:19 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Q's Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com You might check with Frazee about the spinner. I saw some spinner parts when I was there a month ago. I would think with all the boards that Mark J has, that he'd have some card cages to spare.. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 17 07:33:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 07:32:38 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client mothost.mot.com, sender jenison@cig.mot.com ) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:31:46 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9711170931.ZM812@calcite> In-Reply-To: Todd Miller "Sega Q's" (Nov 15, 10:47am) References: <199711151700.MAA27703@po_box.cig.mot.com> X-face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Q's Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Nov 15, 10:47am, Todd Miller wrote: > Subject: Sega Q's > I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to find one & was > wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? Yes, the raster and vector games have the same card cage. > If so what what games used them ? Space Odessey (versions 1 and 2), AstroBlaster, Monster Bash and 005. > I thought about building one using edge card connectors > & point to point wiring (not looking forward to all that soldering) but I am concerned if it would > be too noisy ? I don't know about noisy, but soldering 82 pins x 6 doesn't sound fun to me :-( > I don't want to alter my space fury cp > for Clay's multi game, anyone have somthing to fit the convertab-cab? (poor or > damaged overlay ok) Something with a spinner would be nice, but I do have > a spare from a tempest. You do realize that you'll still need the "Single board interface" even if you use the Tempest spinner... Any of the more common control panels will do, even non G80 games, like Congo Bongo, Zaxxon will fit. I'm all sold out on spare card cages. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Jenison E-mail address: jenison@cig.mot.com Cellular Infrastructure Group Motorola--Arlington Heights, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 17 08:41:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:41:02 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: From: "Ozdemir, Steve" To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: No recap needed....funny vectors from board Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:40:52 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com G'day folks, Turns out that between reflowing the pins on the deflection board, discovering that pins were pushed loose on the deflection board's main connector and finding a blown fuse, I avoided having to install the Zanen kit. But none the less, thanks to everyone who responded to my questions about the various parts in the Zanen kit! I have several Tempest board sets that coin up, but have strange or no display. I think the one that would be easiest to repair would be the board set collapses half the image into a line (but is fine other than that). Would a bad op (either T081 or T082, I forget) amp behave in this fashion? Has anyone else seen this symptom? The problem is definitely not in the monitor (or the board's pots), since I put the board set in another "good" Tempest with the same results. The other two boards have random vectors (so there's no discernible image) or no image what so ever. Tracking down these problems without an oscilliscope seem much more difficult to me than the 1/2 display board set. Thanks in advance for any advice! Steven S Ozdemir sso@dsc.com ps - If my repair questions about this vector game are inappropriate for this email list, then just say the word and I'll take my questions elsewhere. These questions may be too basic for this email list? > From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 17 08:59:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:59:25 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:00:24 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: G-80 Spinner interface boards... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi everybody-- Since the Sega Multigame board is my first design done in OrCAD Layout Plus, I decided it'd be smart to do a little prototype run before I do a whole bunch of "production" boards and screw something up and wind up with expensive little coasters. ;-) So... I'm going to run a few boards as a test. Since it's an experiment anyway, I designed a replacement for the "Single Player Control Panel Interface" and put it on the same PCB. If any of you need a "Spinner Interface Board" let me know! I figure they'll be about $15-20 each (fully populated). I changed the Sega "spinner" PCB a little-- instead of the 3x5 "grid" type connector I put down a 15 pin .156" header (MUCH easier to find, and I already had a PCB footprint for it). Depending on your setup you'll probably need to make a cable or replace the connector on your existing harness. The PCB is smaller than the Sega one (to keep the price down) so the mounting holes are left off. Other than that, it's a functional equivalent using the same parts. Unless there's a huge demand for these I'll probably just do 4 or 6 panels... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 17 19:34:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:34:23 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 21:29:14 -0600 Subject: Re: G-80 Spinner interface boards... Message-ID: <19971117.212914.9334.1.gonzothegreat@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-10,14-18 From: gonzothegreat@juno.com (Alan J McCormick) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:00:24 -0800 Clay Cowgill writes: >So... I'm going to run a few boards as a test. Since it's an >experiment >anyway, I designed a replacement for the "Single Player Control Panel >Interface" and put it on the same PCB. If any of you need a "Spinner >Interface Board" let me know! I figure they'll be about $15-20 each A minor question for the master :) I've got a few Arkanoid spinners (with a lead on two from a Cocktail Arkanoid) and I would like to know if it is possible to use them with this interface board. Or should I wait for your PIC do-everything spinner interface? p.s. Where do I send the $$$ for the Multigame? Drool! Virtu-Al From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Mon Nov 17 21:16:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 21:16:08 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 23:16:33 -0500 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: woodcock@dfwmm.net (Gregg Woodcock) Subject: Re: Audio Reg on Tempest or Gravitar Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 8:57 11/4/97, Ozdemir, Steve wrote: >G'day folks, > >This is a simple (and perhaps stupid) question. I found two spare audio >regulator boards from a Tempest and Gravitar while I was digging around >in my storage unit this morning. I was considering doing that >conversion that Ray documented a while back where I modify my Asteroids >to play Asteroids Deluxe also. > >As I remember, the only major modification was swapping out the >Asteroids audio regulator board for a more advanced version (Audio Reg >II?). Is either the Tempest or Gravitar audio regulator board advanced >enough? (The Gravitar audio regulator board didn't look "populated >enough" to be an Audio Reg II.) Thanks in advance for any help! If you are putting an AD board in an A cabinet then you are fine using the Audio Reg I cuz it can be turned way down and sound just fine. The problem arises when you put an A board in an AD cabinet. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 18 07:48:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 07:47:44 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971118074906.008c46b0@mail.cris.com> X-Sender: wernst@mail.cris.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 07:49:06 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: "Warren 'Llama' Ernst" Subject: Re: No recap needed....funny vectors from board In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 08:40 AM 11/17/97 -0800, you wrote: >G'day folks, >I have several Tempest board sets that coin up, but have strange or no >display. I think the one that would be easiest to repair would be the >board set collapses half the image into a line (but is fine other than >that). Would a bad op (either T081 or T082, I forget) amp behave in this >fashion? Has anyone else seen this symptom? The problem is definitely >not in the monitor (or the board's pots), since I put the board set in >another "good" Tempest with the same results. > >The other two boards have random vectors (so there's no discernible >image) or no image what so ever. Tracking down these problems without >an oscilliscope seem much more difficult to me than the 1/2 display >board set. Thanks in advance for any advice! Steve, You know how you had to reflow the solder around the pins of the monitor boards due to age? Well, do you know how many pins you have on the Tempest Board and the Aux board that are waiting to have the solder reflowed? About 80, that's how much. Loose connections on those pins can cause lots of weird problems, including the some of the ones that you describe. I would, before doing anything else, remove the connector cables and really reflow all teh solder around the pins. In my case, I had to actually remove and re-solder all the pins - the connections were that flakey and the pins are so tiny and have so little extra solder. But it can, should, and must be done to every Tempest board you have before trying anything else. Good luck! Virtually, Warr ------------------------------+---------------------------------------- Reviewer, "Windows Magazine" | Warren Ernst - warren@techie.com Author, "Using Netscape" | http://www.cris.com/~wernst/ "Internet 1997 Unleashed" (c) | Computer Journalist, Consultant, Author "Netscape 3 Unleashed"(contr) | Graphic Artist, Nerd "Presenting ActiveX" | Que and Sams.Net Publishing | "If it ain't broke, don't break it." ------------------------------+---------------------------------------- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 18 10:59:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 10:59:40 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <01BCF411.61ED6320@Obie> From: David Shoemaker To: "'vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com'" Subject: RE: Sega multigame- Works! Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 11:01:43 -0800 X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Ill take one. David begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(C<3`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$-@ 0` M`@````(``@`!!) &`% !```!````# ````,``# #````"P`/#@`````"`?\/ M`0```%L`````````@2L?I+ZC$!F=;@#=`0]4`@````!V96-T;W)L:7-T0&=O M;VYS<75A9"YS<&EE Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 11:02:15 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 11:03:17 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: G-80 Spinner interface boards... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >On Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:00:24 -0800 Clay Cowgill >writes: >I've got a few Arkanoid spinners (with a lead on two from a Cocktail >Arkanoid) and I would like to know if it is possible to use them with >this interface board. Or should I wait for your PIC do-everything spinner >interface? The Sega Spinner Interface board takes two quadrature inputs and outputs a 7 bit + direction count. My little PIC spinner thing does the same, but since the Sega uses an I/O write line to select either "buttons" or "spinner" for input you still need a PCB to handle the muxing of the two. I'll know more for sure when I get the first samples of the G80 daughtercard and spinner, but I suspect that pretty much anything that uses an optical interrupter type quadrature system would work for input to the Spinner board. I've got a Tron spinner, a Tempest one, a couple Atari Whirly-gigs (Blasteroids), and a Sega spinner to try (plus an HP and Clarostat encoder). I'll try to make a little "compatibility" chart. >p.s. Where do I send the $$$ for the Multigame? Drool! I'll let everyone know once the prototypes check out. ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 18 18:07:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:06:52 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 20:07:18 -0500 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: woodcock@dfwmm.net (Gregg Woodcock) Subject: Re: Sega Q's Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 9:31 11/17/97, Mark Jenison wrote: >On Nov 15, 10:47am, Todd Miller wrote: >> Subject: Sega Q's >> I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to find one >& was >> wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? > >Yes, the raster and vector games have the same card cage. > >> If so what what games used them ? > >Space Odessey (versions 1 and 2), AstroBlaster, Monster Bash and 005. Are you certain about this? I have been told by many people that they are NOT COMPATIBLE! Did you actually do an experiment or see it with your own eyes? From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 18 18:33:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:33:51 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 21:29:48 -0500 (EST) From: Ed Henciak X-Sender: ethst3@unixs3.cis.pitt.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Question about Clay's multigame In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I guess this is primarily directed towards Clay, but others may have a little input... Anyway, I was wondering if you could add a little circuit to your daughtercard to eliminate having to hook up that 3VAC (I think) to the G80 system. This would totally eliminate that flaky power supply and would make the mess under my ST cockpit seat a lot neater :)!!!! I read in the Sega XY FAQ that a 555 may work as a viable sub for that stupid 3VAC. I'd try it out, but I doubt I have the time right now between school and work. I hate to bring up ideas and let others try them at the expense of their time, but this would benefit all if it does work. How does this sound? What I could do is get the values needed for the 555. I guess all we'd need is a square wave with a Vpp of 6V running at 60Hz. If others do not want this feature, It could be bypassed with a jumper. No big engineering feat, I know :). Oh well, take care and have fun!!!! Ed From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 18 18:40:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:40:36 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:40:34 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "Anyway, I was wondering if you could add a little circuit to your daughtercard to eliminate having to hook up that 3VAC (I think) to the G80 system." ..tie it to +12 through a resistor if you look at the CPU schematic, it's just part of the power/up reset circuit. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 18 18:54:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:54:43 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Timestamp: 19 Nov 1997 02:53:45 GMT Message-ID: <34725515.5A945D83@netconx.net> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 20:55:17 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Ed Henciak wrote: > I guess this is primarily directed towards Clay, but others may have a > little input... > > Anyway, I was wondering if you could add a little circuit to your > daughtercard to eliminate having to hook up that 3VAC (I think) to the G80 > >From what I remember the 3vac feeds to a 555, I think it's set up as a one-shot to the reset on the z80, but I don't have the doc's w/me. I have a temperary setup un my bench using a switching power supply from a pc & my XY scope. What I did was use the 'Power good' signal from the switcher to sub as the 3vacand it seems to work just fine. -- Thanks Todd FWIW: I have changed ISP's old: www.willowtree.com/~litterbox litterbox@willowtree.com good til 11/30/97 new: www.netconx.net/~litterbox litterbox@netconx.net From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 04:33:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 04:33:30 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Lotus-Fromdomain: SYBASENOTES From: "Paul Tonizzo" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Message-Id: <85256554.0044BDE5.00@gwwest.sybase.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 07:33:04 -0500 Subject: Re: Sega Q's Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >At 9:31 11/17/97, Mark Jenison wrote: >>On Nov 15, 10:47am, Todd Miller wrote: >>> Subject: Sega Q's >>> I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to find one >>& was >>> wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? >>Yes, the raster and vector games have the same card cage. >> >>> If so what what games used them ? >> >>Space Odessey (versions 1 and 2), AstroBlaster, Monster Bash and 005. > >Are you certain about this? I have been told by many people that they are >NOT COMPATIBLE! Did you actually do an experiment or see it with your own >eyes? They are absolutely 100% compatible. I was running all games (XY and raster) out of one cage at one time. Paul From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 04:35:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 04:35:44 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Lotus-Fromdomain: SYBASENOTES From: "Paul Tonizzo" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Message-Id: <85256554.004501D7.00@gwwest.sybase.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 07:35:02 -0500 Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >"Anyway, I was wondering if you could add a little circuit to your >daughtercard to eliminate having to hook up that 3VAC (I think) to the G80 >system." > > >..tie it to +12 through a resistor > >if you look at the CPU schematic, it's just part of the power/up reset >circuit. Easier yet - just tie it to +5v. All my games are running this way (XY and raster). Paul From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 04:46:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 04:46:06 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Lotus-Fromdomain: SYBASENOTES From: "Paul Tonizzo" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Message-Id: <85256554.00453936.00@gwwest.sybase.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 07:45:47 -0500 Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >I guess this is primarily directed towards Clay, but others may have a >little input... > >Anyway, I was wondering if you could add a little circuit to your >daughtercard to eliminate having to hook up that 3VAC (I think) to the G80 >system. This would totally eliminate that flaky power supply and would >make the mess under my ST cockpit seat a lot neater :)!!!! I read in the >Sega XY FAQ that a 555 may work as a viable sub for that stupid 3VAC. I'd >try it out, but I doubt I have the time right now between school and work. >I hate to bring up ideas and let others try them at the expense of their >time, but this would benefit all if it does work. How does this sound? >What I could do is get the values needed for the 555. I guess all we'd >need is a square wave with a Vpp of 6V running at 60Hz. If others do not >want this feature, It could be bypassed with a jumper. No big engineering >feat, I know :). Oh well, take care and have fun!!!! You're actually talking baout two different things here. The 3VAC is only required to keep the Z-80 from reseting. The whole idea Sega had behind this was that they found a quick power on/off would sometimes credit the game. The 3VAC guaranteed a reset CPU on powerdown/up. The really annoying thing is that the coining circuit requires a 1ms pulse to actually coin the game. This was another of Sega's ideas to reduce the chances of someone tripping a free credit any other way than with a coin. Here's a simple 555 timer circuit that will let you use a regular Jamma-type low signal to coin the game (you can also use the service switch but this doesn't help for 4-player Eliminator): Sega Coin Hack -------------- Paul Tonizzo (tonizzo@sybase.com OR aq929@torfree.net) This hack is used to defeat the idiotic coining mechanism on Sega's G-80 games. The basics are that the circuit uses a 555 timer to generate a clock pulse. The pulse itself is low for ~1ms and then high for ~1ms and repeats itself (1ms was the optimal value for the pulse width to get the coin to trigger). The circuit itself is not at all unlike the rapid fire circuit for some Midway games (but it has been greatly simplified.) Here's all you need to build it: Qty Desc --- ---- 1 555 timer chip (8-pin) 1 8-pin socket (for the 555) 2 0.1 uF capacitor (use mylar caps) 2 1 Meg ohm resistor You should be able to use a really small piece of perfboard to make this. (1-1/2" square would do it.) Wire it up as follows: - pins 4 and 8 of socket to +5v - one side of first 1M resistor to +5v, other side to pin 7 of socket - one side of second 1M resistor to pin 7 of socket, other side to pins 2 and 6 of socket - one side of first 0.1 uF cap to pin 5 of socket, other side to pin 1 of socket - one side of second 0.1 uF cap to pin 2 of socket, other side to pin 1 of socket - pin 1 of socket to pin 5 on G-80 CPU board - pin 3 of socket to pin 6 on G-80 CPU board For all games except 4-player Eliminator: - pin 1 of socket goes to coin or a coining button of some kind For 4-player Eliminator: - you also require 4 general purpose diodes (1N4001 will do) - take all 4 diodes and the ends closest to the black line should all be tied together (this is the end the electrons CAN flow to). These ends then get attached to pin 1 of the socket - the other ends of the four diodes should go to the coining buttons (one for each player) - the coining buttons also go to pins 2-5 on the i/o board. - the only other thing that changes on the i/o board is that the board outputs that go to pins 5 and 6 on the G-80 CPU board should be cut. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 07:01:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 07:01:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client pobox.mot.com, sender jenison@cig.mot.com ) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 09:00:25 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Jenison Message-Id: <9711190900.ZM14047@calcite> In-Reply-To: woodcock@dfwmm.net (Gregg Woodcock) "Re: Sega Q's" (Nov 18, 8:07pm) References: <199711190217.VAA10690@po_box.cig.mot.com> X-face: "@9[FFAftX<9}2=gaPlIyRv_K%h[>.@"8t}B2So!iv.\#M9NplA9bDudBQ|]E`WL9Kd,Tn2v.0OGcE<$yg{&}(m:mB\GO9L+yE}6=d17BM X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.1 10apr95) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Q's Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Nov 18, 8:07pm, Gregg Woodcock wrote: > Subject: Re: Sega Q's > At 9:31 11/17/97, Mark Jenison wrote: > >On Nov 15, 10:47am, Todd Miller wrote: > >> Subject: Sega Q's > >> I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to find one > >& was > >> wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? > > > >Yes, the raster and vector games have the same card cage. > > > >> If so what what games used them ? > > > >Space Odessey (versions 1 and 2), AstroBlaster, Monster Bash and 005. > > Are you certain about this? I have been told by many people that they are > NOT COMPATIBLE! Did you actually do an experiment or see it with your own > eyes? Yes they are 100% the same; it's a G-80 system cage, and the G-80 system ran both raster and vector games. I sold a few Zektor sets by parting out Astroblaster cages and using those. ________________ ______ ___ _____ __ / __/ / / / |/ / / |/ //|/|/|_______________ Mark Jenison / __/ /_/ / / / | // | / |__ __/ _ /__ \ jenison@cig.mot.com /___/___/_/_//_/_/_/|_//__|/__| / / / // / / Sega XY FAQ author /_/|_| /_/ /____/_/|_| ________________ The One and Only 4-player vector game From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 08:52:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 08:51:48 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 08:52:40 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Anyway, I was wondering if you could add a little circuit to your >daughtercard to eliminate having to hook up that 3VAC (I think) to the G80 >system. What I do is just tie one leg of R7 (someone might want to double-check that number) to +5. On the CPU board it's an easy modification since R7 is a big 1/4W resistor and one end of it is close to one of the +5V pins on a neighboring TTL/LS chip. About 1/2" of wire and 2 seconds with a soldering iron "fixes" the reset circuit. I run mine off an old PC-XT supply without any problems. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 08:57:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 08:57:21 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 08:58:26 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >The really annoying thing is that the coining circuit requires a 1ms pulse >to actually coin the game. This was another of Sega's ideas to reduce >the chances of someone tripping a free credit any other way than with a >coin. Ahhh... I was noticing that in the game code... It looks like it's in the exact same spot for every game. Should I just get rid of the pulse timing stuff in the binaries for the multigame? (I figured most people would be using it in a "real" cabinet so it wouldn't matter, but if there's reason for me to just change it in the code I don't think it's a big deal...) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 08:58:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 08:58:53 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 08:59:56 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Sega Q's Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >>> I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to find one >>& was >>> wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? [...] >>Space Odessey (versions 1 and 2), AstroBlaster, Monster Bash and 005. > >Are you certain about this? I have been told by many people that they are >NOT COMPATIBLE! Did you actually do an experiment or see it with your own >eyes? I've done this with AstroBlaster from the hardware side-- no problems. -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 09:35:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 09:35:05 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: Message-Id: <9711191734.AA23978@savage.raleigh.ibm.com> Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 12:34:22 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "Clay Cowgill" at Nov 19, 97 08:58:26 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 876 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > Ahhh... I was noticing that in the game code... It looks like it's in the > exact same spot for every game. Should I just get rid of the pulse timing > stuff in the binaries for the multigame? (I figured most people would be > using it in a "real" cabinet so it wouldn't matter, but if there's reason > for me to just change it in the code I don't think it's a big deal...) I, for one, would be running it out of my Space Duel/multi-game cabinet. Then again, it doesn't sound like the hardware is too hard to fake-out. Maybe you could have two sets of binaries? :-) +-------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | John W. Linville To Be, Rather Than To Seem. | | linvjw@vnet.ibm.com I will not torment the emotionally frail... :-) | +-------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 10:29:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:29:47 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199711191723.LAA01659@fermat.mayo.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 4.1mach v148) In-Reply-To: X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 4.1mach (Enhance 2.0b5) From: Ray Ghanbari Date: Wed, 19 Nov 97 11:23:54 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame References: Organization: Mayo Foundation Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com You wrote: > Ahhh... I was noticing that in the game code... It looks like it's in the > exact same spot for every game. Should I just get rid of the pulse timing > stuff in the binaries for the multigame? (I figured most people would be > using it in a "real" cabinet so it wouldn't matter, but if there's reason > for me to just change it in the code I don't think it's a big deal...) Actually, mine will be in an Atari vector cabinet. I was going to going to wire up a little timing switch like Paul described. Having modified code seems to be the best route, esp. if it is an easy fix. The modified code would be backwards compatible with "real" sega cabinets, so presumably it's not a biggie. Ray From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 10:34:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:34:31 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:34:28 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "The modified code would be backwards compatible with "real" sega cabinets, so presumably it's not a biggie." I assume noone here is worried about switch bounce giving them extra credits :-) From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 10:41:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:41:49 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Lotus-Fromdomain: SYBASENOTES From: "Paul Tonizzo" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Message-Id: <85256554.00633EA6.00@gwwest.sybase.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 13:05:34 -0500 Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >>The really annoying thing is that the coining circuit requires a 1ms pulse >>to actually coin the game. This was another of Sega's ideas to reduce >>the chances of someone tripping a free credit any other way than with a >>coin. > >Ahhh... I was noticing that in the game code... It looks like it's in the >exact same spot for every game. Should I just get rid of the pulse timing >stuff in the binaries for the multigame? (I figured most people would be >using it in a "real" cabinet so it wouldn't matter, but if there's reason >for me to just change it in the code I don't think it's a big deal...) I was going to do the same thing at some point but by all means, if you can change the binaries for each game I know several people would be very grateful!!! Thanks, Paul From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 10:44:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:44:14 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:45:24 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Actually, mine will be in an Atari vector cabinet. I was going to going to >wire up a little timing switch like Paul described. Having modified code >seems >to be the best route, esp. if it is an easy fix. The modified code would be >backwards compatible with "real" sega cabinets, so presumably it's not a >biggie. Right-- worst case it might be more prone to giving more than one credit at a time or something. No big deal for collectors. I'll look into it. Nice thing about the multigame is that any changes like this only require burning a single EPROM to update everything... Travis Hagen used my Sega Vector Editor on the PC to make some really nice logos for all the games (like the ones on the covers of the manuals), so I might try dropping those into the menu system to spruce it up... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 10:49:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:49:39 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:49:36 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Preliminary Cosmic Chasm hardware info Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I sat down this morning and dumped my CC eprom sets, and started looking at the hardware. Nice, simple vector design (as opposed to Aztarac!). It looks like it has 8 commands which appear in the top 3 bits of a 16 bit word. The low 12 bits are the operand. It appears to have a vector PC that starts at 0 in the shared static RAM (20k total). Since there is only a 12 bit PC, I assume it only can address RAM :-) (..just looked on the RAM schematic, and there are only 16 lines on the "ram address bus" (oops, the vector PC is 16 bits wide, the top bits are always loaded with 0 on a jump..). The instruction set: 0 Halt 1 Jump <12 bit adr> 2 Color 3 delta Y 4 Y 5 delta X 6 X 7 vector length It appears that there are three interrupts (6840 timer, vg, audio) and a watchdog that can be disabled. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 10:53:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:53:11 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:53:06 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "Travis Hagen used my Sega Vector Editor on the PC to make some really nice logos for all the games (like the ones on the covers of the manuals), so I might try dropping those into the menu system to spruce it up..." cool... re: overrunning the vector engine I guess I never told you what the numbers on top of the simulated display were for... I had put up the symbol and vector count, and there was supposed to be a 'vector time used' percentage as well, so you could tell in the simulation if you'd run out of drawing time on a real display. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 11:08:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 11:08:27 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 11:09:25 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Question about Clay's multigame Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >I was going to do the same thing at some point but by all means, if >you can change the binaries for each game I know several people would >be very grateful!!! Ok, I'll check it out. I know the code on all the games *far* better than I'd like to now... ;-) (I actually coin my system up by poking at the port pins with an aligator clip, so I suppose this will be a good exercise to make me add a coin-switch to test with.) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 12:43:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 12:43:18 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 14:41:42 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711191941.OAA02005@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com cc: dras@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com Subject: Amplifone monitor and Zannen cap kit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi, I have been working on my Amplifone monitor and have what really feels like a stupid question regarding a cap kit. (I did call Zannen about it and they couldn't quite answer the question so I'll ask here...). There are two 100uf, 50V caps on the deflection board (c19 & c20) which were included in the kit. The caps in the kit had an unfamiliar marking on them for polarity. Instead of a "-" sign on the striped side of the cap, it had "ce". I just assumed that was negative and installed it that way but now I am wondering (and I don't want to re-fry my boards). When I called Zannen, Aubrey just told me that the side with the short lead is the negative side, which is a nice thing to know but too late for me. Does anyone know if the side marked "ce" is the negative side? I asked Aubrey some other questions, these were his answers (note that they are paraphrased, not direct quotes): Q: Why replace the HV board's C1 and C2 (470uf, 50V) with 1000uf, 50V caps? A: Better performance, don't worry about it. Q: Why replace C7, C8, C9, and C10 (.47uf, 50V) on the deflection board with 1uf, 50V caps? A: .47uf is non standard (implied no longer available). Don't worry about it. Other questions.... I'm still not sure if my HV board is good and would like to first test the monitor without it. Can I just run it with the HV board disconnected and listen to the deflection board to hear if its drawing vectors. I have had to put some work into the deflection board because R31, R30, R28, R35, .... were fried (espcially R30, it was completely toast, and burned a nice little hole in C13 and almost through the board). This happened when I was running the machine without the HV board attached and now I'm afraid of toasting the deflection board again. Any comments on this? How should I go about testing? Two traces have separated from solder side of the deflection board where R30 burned. I have worked around it for now but is there a way to re-attach these traces to the board? Thanks very much. And thanks also to those who answered my preivious Amplifone questions. Dan R. dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 13:21:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 13:21:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 15:20:38 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Amplifone monitor and Zannen cap kit In-Reply-To: <199711191941.OAA02005@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 19 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > Hi, > > I have been working on my Amplifone monitor and have what really feels > like a stupid question regarding a cap kit. (I did call Zannen about > it and they couldn't quite answer the question so I'll ask here...). There > are two 100uf, 50V caps on the deflection board (c19 & c20) which were > included in the kit. The caps in the kit had an unfamiliar marking on > them for polarity. Instead of a "-" sign on the striped side of the cap, > it had "ce". I just assumed that was negative and installed it that way > but now I am wondering (and I don't want to re-fry my boards). When I > called Zannen, Aubrey just told me that the side with the short lead is > the negative side, which is a nice thing to know but too late for me. Does > anyone know if the side marked "ce" is the negative side? I have a Zanen Kit for the Amplifone at home, and I will check to see which is the short lead when I go home later (if somebody doesn't give you an answer before then) > I asked Aubrey some other questions, these were his answers (note that > they are paraphrased, not direct quotes): > > Q: Why replace the HV board's C1 and C2 (470uf, 50V) with 1000uf, > 50V caps? > A: Better performance, don't worry about it. These are just filter capacitors, so they should be OK. Are these the ones that you are supposed to replace with low ESR caps or not? I always forget if that's C1, C2 or C3, C4. As an aside, were low-ESR caps the "standard issue" on the Amplifone? I replaced these (the ones that are supposed to be low-ESR) with "regular" caps, and everything seems fine. > Other questions.... I'm still not sure if my HV board is good and would > like to first test the monitor without it. Can I just run it with the > HV board disconnected and listen to the deflection board to hear if its > drawing vectors. I have had to put some work into the deflection board > because R31, R30, R28, R35, .... were fried (espcially R30, it was > completely toast, and burned a nice little hole in C13 and almost through > the board). This happened when I was running the machine without the HV > board attached and now I'm afraid of toasting the deflection board again. > Any comments on this? How should I go about testing? Yeah, you can run it with the HV board unplugged and look at the spot killer. Of course, since the video B+ gets fed back from the HV board to the deflection board, you're not really testing it completely. The only things that can sink enough current to toast resistors on the defletion board are the deflection transistors, or maybe even the pre-drivers. I doubt an HV problem caused those to toast. If you have a short on the HV board, one of the two fuses located near the connector that goes to the HV board will usually blow (or both might blow...) A "normal" deflection board won't toast istelf as a result of this, and operating the deflection board with the HV board unplugged has the same effect as having those fuses blown. > Two traces have separated from solder side of the deflection board where > R30 burned. I have worked around it for now but is there a way to re-attach > these traces to the board? Krazy glue might work. Usually I just don't worry about it. Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 13:41:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 13:40:58 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19971119214323.02924064@heartlab.com> X-Sender: cmoore@heartlab.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:43:23 -0500 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: "Christopher V. Moore" Subject: Re: Amplifone monitor and Zannen cap kit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 03:20 PM 11/19/97 -0600, jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > >On Wed, 19 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > > Krazy glue might work. Usually I just don't worry about it. > >Joe > I seem to remember that Duncan Brown posted a warning on RGVAC not to use Krazy glue. It has something nasty in it that outgasses when heated with a soldering iron. I don't remember what it was. If Duncan gets this list maybe he can repost his message. -- Christopher V. Moore -- Principal Engineer Heartlab, Inc. - 101 Airport Rd - Westerly, RI 02891 Phone: (401) 596-0592 - Fax: (401) 596-8562 - Email: cmoore@heartlab.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 13:59:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 13:59:17 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <347362E6.19DF@an.hp.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:06:30 -0500 From: Joel Rosenzweig Organization: Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Amplifone monitor and Zannen cap kit References: <1.5.4.32.19971119214323.02924064@heartlab.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Christopher V. Moore wrote: > > At 03:20 PM 11/19/97 -0600, jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > > > >On Wed, 19 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > > > > > > > Krazy glue might work. Usually I just don't worry about it. > > > >Joe > > > > I seem to remember that Duncan Brown posted a warning on RGVAC not to use Krazy > glue. It has something nasty in it that outgasses when heated with a > soldering iron. I don't remember what it was. If Duncan gets this list > maybe he can repost his message. > Instant glue, such as Krazy Glue, contains, cyanoacrylate. Cyanoacrylate is a derivative of cyanide. The theory goes that if you were to heat the trace (with your soldering iron) enough, it could vaporize the glue, which would create cyanide gas. Which in turn, could put an end to your video game habbit. Permanently. I'm an engineer, not a chemist, so I don't know the validity of the assertion. However, I'm not going to be a candidate to try it either. :-) I just run jumper wire when this happens to me. It at least has no lethal potential. ;-) Joel- From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 15:31:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 15:31:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34737619.6D21@links.magenta.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:28:25 -0700 From: Jess Askey Organization: The Audio Analyst/The Game Spot X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Amplifone monitor and Zannen cap kit References: <1.5.4.32.19971119214323.02924064@heartlab.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Christopher V. Moore wrote: > > At 03:20 PM 11/19/97 -0600, jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > > > >On Wed, 19 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > > > > > > > Krazy glue might work. Usually I just don't worry about it. > > > >Joe > > > > I seem to remember that Duncan Brown posted a warning on RGVAC not to use Krazy > glue. It has something nasty in it that outgasses when heated with a > soldering iron. I don't remember what it was. If Duncan gets this list > maybe he can repost his message. Super Glue has Cyanoacrylate in it. When you heat it up with a soldering iron it supposedly creates cyanide gas. Very Toxic stuff. :=0 jess -- Jess M. Askey ************* My Page *************** ESLB/The Audio Analyst * http://magenta.com/havoc * 509 S. 2nd Street Unit B **********Pins/Vids For Sale ******** Laramie WY 82070 * http://magenta.com/havoc/game-spot * From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 19 16:42:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:42:44 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:38:50 -0600 Subject: Re: Amplifone monitor and Zannen cap kit Message-ID: <19971119.170351.12174.0.gonzothegreat@juno.com> References: <1.5.4.32.19971119214323.02924064@heartlab.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-7,10-12,16-17,19-21 From: gonzothegreat@juno.com (Alan J McCormick) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:43:23 -0500 "Christopher V. Moore" writes: >At 03:20 PM 11/19/97 -0600, jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: >>On Wed, 19 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: >> Krazy glue might work. Usually I just don't worry about it. > >I seem to remember that Duncan Brown posted a warning on RGVAC not to use >Krazy glue. It has something nasty in it that outgasses when heated with a >soldering iron. I don't remember what it was. Krazy Glue (c) outgasses cyanide (as seen in Bhopal, India) when drying - whether you let it air dry, heat it or use those fancy accelerator potions. It would probably be safer to use something more heat stable. Maybe a binary epoxy? DB was right about cyanide gas getting in your eyes. Never use it to repair your glasses :( Virtu-Al From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 08:31:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 08:30:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:30:10 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711201630.LAA02458@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com CC: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: My amplifone monitor... update Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hello again, Thanks to joelr@an.hp.com for letting me know about the ce being the negative side of the caps. Anyway, I got the boards together and plugged them in last night and had another light show. Again I fried a bunch of resistors: R30, R35, and R34. This time I also blew out F2. Looking back at what jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.ed had to say: > The only things that can sink enough current to toast resistors on > the defletion board are the deflection transistors, or maybe even the > pre-drivers. I doubt an HV problem caused those to toast. If you have a > short on the HV board, one of the two fuses located near the connector > that goes to the HV board will usually blow (or both might blow...) A > "normal" deflection board won't toast istelf as a result of this, and > operating the deflection board with the HV board unplugged has the same > effect as having those fuses blown. > I had hoped that the new transistors (Q16, Q17) had solved the problem. After watching the sparks (plasma) fly, I figured Q14 and/or Q15 were the problem. Sure enough, I pulled out Q14 and it was shorted all the way around (I think Q15 had problems too). The transistors on the other side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. Thanks. Dan R. dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 09:01:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:00:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:59:56 -0500 (EST) From: "Christopher X. Candreva" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update In-Reply-To: <199711201630.LAA02458@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Thu, 20 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these > parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked > at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. I ordered from Mouser (www.mouser.com) -- they have a decent on-line database. Can take a while though. ========================================================== Chris Candreva -- chris@westnet.com -- (914) 967-7816 WestNet Internet Services of Westchester http://www.westnet.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 09:09:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:08:36 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:08:33 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Circuit Specialists www.cir.com had them in their last catalog for $1.50 (but they may be gone now..) From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 09:10:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:09:41 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:09:04 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update In-Reply-To: <199711201630.LAA02458@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Thu, 20 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > I had hoped that the new transistors (Q16, Q17) had solved the problem. > After watching the sparks (plasma) fly, I figured Q14 and/or Q15 were > the problem. Sure enough, I pulled out Q14 and it was shorted all the > way around (I think Q15 had problems too). The transistors on the other > side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these > parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked > at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. > I haven't used the NTE replacements (I have no doubt that they work, though) but if the prices are too ridiculous (as the prices on some NTE stuff is) you might try Competetive Products. I bought some MPS-U57s from them a couple of months ago for like $1.50 each. I think they have MPS-U07s, too, but for some reason, the U07s seem to be common around here, so I just bought them from my neighborhood electronics store... Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 09:30:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:29:55 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: jeffh@mail.diac.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 10:28:57 -0700 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: jeffh@diac.com (Jeff Hendrix) Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Circuit Specialists has them in their 1998 catalog. www.cir.com 1-800-528-1417 MPSU07 $1.48 MPSU57 $1.88 -jeff >Hello again, > >Thanks to joelr@an.hp.com for letting me know about the ce being >the negative side of the caps. Anyway, I got the boards together and >plugged them in last night and had another light show. Again I fried >a bunch of resistors: R30, R35, and R34. This time I also blew out >F2. Looking back at what jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.ed had to say: > >> The only things that can sink enough current to toast resistors on >> the defletion board are the deflection transistors, or maybe even the >> pre-drivers. I doubt an HV problem caused those to toast. If you have a >> short on the HV board, one of the two fuses located near the connector >> that goes to the HV board will usually blow (or both might blow...) A >> "normal" deflection board won't toast istelf as a result of this, and >> operating the deflection board with the HV board unplugged has the same >> effect as having those fuses blown. >> >I had hoped that the new transistors (Q16, Q17) had solved the problem. >After watching the sparks (plasma) fly, I figured Q14 and/or Q15 were >the problem. Sure enough, I pulled out Q14 and it was shorted all the >way around (I think Q15 had problems too). The transistors on the other >side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these >parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked >at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. > >Thanks. > >Dan R. >dras@sw.stratus.com jeffh@diac.com Buy/Sell/Trade classic video arcade games. www.diac.com/~jeffh/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 09:39:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:38:41 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971120114008.009307c0@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:40:09 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 11:09 AM 11/20/97 -0600, you wrote: > >On Thu, 20 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > >> I had hoped that the new transistors (Q16, Q17) had solved the problem. >> After watching the sparks (plasma) fly, I figured Q14 and/or Q15 were >> the problem. Sure enough, I pulled out Q14 and it was shorted all the >> way around (I think Q15 had problems too). The transistors on the other >> side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these >> parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked >> at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. >> > > I haven't used the NTE replacements (I have no doubt that they >work, though) but if the prices are too ridiculous (as the prices on some >NTE stuff is) you might try Competetive Products. I bought some MPS-U57s >from them a couple of months ago for like $1.50 each. I think they have >MPS-U07s, too, but for some reason, the U07s seem to be common around >here, so I just bought them from my neighborhood electronics store... > >Joe > > > I have used the NTE replacements ... and yes, Joe is correct that they are ridiculously expensive. But, I am the type of person who hates waiting around for parts :) Mit From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 10:36:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 10:36:05 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:55:17 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: <199711201630.LAA02458@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> from "Dan Rasmussen" at Nov 20, 97 11:30:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347487950.3a23@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 973 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > I had hoped that the new transistors (Q16, Q17) had solved the problem. > After watching the sparks (plasma) fly, I figured Q14 and/or Q15 were > the problem. Sure enough, I pulled out Q14 and it was shorted all the > way around (I think Q15 had problems too). The transistors on the other > side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these > parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked > at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. Just to ask a silly question, aren't these mounted with mica insulators? Did you put those back in (and heat sink compound)? (I've worked on a couple of monitors that people omitted that step and wondered what went wrong.. *poof*) Kurt /* * This version of Kurt Mahan is currently being evaluated. Words he speaks * are those of him only and not those of Novell or anybody else. * * Novell Java Technologies R&D Group * * Kurt Mahan * kmahan@novell.com */ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 10:55:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 10:54:17 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 13:53:44 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711201853.NAA02543@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com CC: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In-reply-to: <347487950.3a23@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> (kmahan@novell.com) Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > > I had hoped that the new transistors (Q16, Q17) had solved the problem. > > After watching the sparks (plasma) fly, I figured Q14 and/or Q15 were > > the problem. Sure enough, I pulled out Q14 and it was shorted all the > > way around (I think Q15 had problems too). The transistors on the other > > side of the board (Q4, Q5) seem to be OK. So, where can I find these > > parts: MPS-U07 and MPS-U57? The Woodcock/Scheive material I have looked > > at tells me that NTE188 and NTE189 are equivalent parts. > > > Just to ask a silly question, aren't these mounted with mica insulators? > > Did you put those back in (and heat sink compound)? (I've worked on a > > couple of monitors that people omitted that step and wondered what went > > wrong.. *poof*) > I had not touched these until I removed them after I re-fried the board. The were mounted with insulators but... When I removed Q14 I noticed that whoever installed it mostly missed the screw hole in the insulator, punching a new one right next to the original. I'm pretty sure the pressure from the screw head was enough to push the tab in contact with the heat sink where the original hole was. I assume this is where it had originally failed. BTW, I just ordered the replacements from Circuit Specialists. The did not have the insulators so I am going to have to find at least one somwhere else. They also didn't have any 3.3 ohm, half watt resistors. Thanks. Dan From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 11:18:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:17:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:18:48 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega Multigame and spinner interface... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I ordered 8 boards for a 24 hour prototype-turn this morning. Should be here Friday or Monday if there aren't any problems with the layout or files. Everything was quintuple checked so I'm expecting them to work first try, but if they don't, well, that's what prototypes are for. ;-) Anyway, assuming things work I should have some spinner interface boards ready early next week. A few daughtercards at the same time. I'll keep you all posted. These were a lot more expensive than I expected-- the board's pretty dense so I'm paying extra for drill time, and I have custom drill sizes for the .156" center connectors on the spinner board. So, the Spinner boards will definately be $20 (assembled) and not $15, still not too bad considering how much fun it is to wire-wrap stuff... ;-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 11:23:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:22:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <34748DBB.EF3B4A9@pobox.com> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 14:21:31 -0500 From: Corey Stup X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update References: <199711201853.NAA02543@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Dan Rasmussen wrote: > When I removed Q14 I noticed that whoever installed it mostly missed the > screw hole in the insulator, punching a new one right next to the original. > I'm pretty sure the pressure from the screw head was enough to push the > tab in contact with the heat sink where the original hole was. I assume > this is where it had originally failed. Another reason to own a variac - detecting previous "repairs"... ;) From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 12:21:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 12:18:33 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: My amplifone monitor... update To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 13:37:29 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: <199711201853.NAA02543@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> from "Dan Rasmussen" at Nov 20, 97 01:53:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <34749f890.3dcf@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 794 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com [...snip...] Mica Insulators: > BTW, I just ordered the replacements from Circuit Specialists. The did not > have the insulators so I am going to have to find at least one somwhere else. > They also didn't have any 3.3 ohm, half watt resistors. Believe it or not but Radio Shack has the insulators and the heat compound goop. (or they did the last time I was working on a Sunday trying to get a monitor going).. Oh yeah -- I've found that after replacing those transistors (after you've mounted them but before you've reattached the wires to the board..) its well worth the 30 seconds with a VOM to make sure you haven't shorted anything out to the chassis (and also to catch the occasional defective transistor in the supposedly good pile.. -- never trust operator's parts..) Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 20 16:50:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:50:28 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:51:23 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Sega Multigame confirmations Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com A few of you were asking about if I received your responses for reserving a Sega multi-game board. I usually don't respond to those, but to make everyone feel better I'll explicitly list everyone that I have on my list: Chris Hanks TomW Corey Stup retrodaddy Ed Henciak Bill Esquivel Todd Miller Ray Ghanbari Kev Dangerwil linvjw Chris Loggans John Butler Zonn Omar Alan McCormick Mark Shostak David Shoemaker Al Travis Clay If you don't see your name on the list I must have missed your reply. (I sorted the mail based on my subject line, so if you changed that it could be lost forever in the "great big Eudora mailbox from hell". :-) The boardhouse says they'll start my prototype run on Friday and it should ship on Monday, so hopefully by Wednesday morning I'll have something to report... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 21 10:14:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 10:13:25 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: jeffh@mail.diac.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 11:12:27 -0700 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: jeffh@diac.com (Jeff Hendrix) Subject: Sega Multigame confirmations Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Me too, Jeff Hendrix >A few of you were asking about if I received your responses for reserving a >Sega multi-game board. I usually don't respond to those, but to make >everyone feel better I'll explicitly list everyone that I have on my list: > >Chris Hanks >TomW >Corey Stup >retrodaddy >Ed Henciak >Bill Esquivel >Todd Miller >Ray Ghanbari >Kev >Dangerwil >linvjw >Chris Loggans >John Butler >Zonn >Omar >Alan McCormick >Mark Shostak >David Shoemaker >Al >Travis >Clay > >If you don't see your name on the list I must have missed your reply. (I >sorted the mail based on my subject line, so if you changed that it could >be lost forever in the "great big Eudora mailbox from hell". :-) > >The boardhouse says they'll start my prototype run on Friday and it should >ship on Monday, so hopefully by Wednesday morning I'll have something to >report... > >-Clay > >Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager >_______________________________________________________________________ >/\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com >\/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ jeffh@diac.com Buy/Sell/Trade classic video arcade games. www.diac.com/~jeffh/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 21 10:24:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 10:24:38 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971121122507.0095e1d0@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com> X-Sender: mmatelsk@bl-mail1.corpeast.baynetworks.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 12:25:08 -0600 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Mit_Matelske@BayNetworks.COM (Mit Matelske) Subject: Re: Sega Multigame confirmations Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 11:12 AM 11/21/97 -0700, you wrote: >Me too, > >Jeff Hendrix > That brings me back to the old-school newsgroup flaming - all the aol'ers with their "me too's" Personally I have always wanted to do it, so- Clay, me too! Mit Matelske ok - so I'm retarded From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 21 15:16:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 15:16:31 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 18:15:56 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711212315.SAA12063@mail-out-1.tiac.net> X-Sender: fishd@pop.tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: fishd Subject: Note to those building an Exorcisor....anyone? Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi Folks, Well I got my Exorcisor built and working yesterday and discovered something important that I think is worth mentioning. On the schematic there are two capacitors, both 220pF, shown at the CLOCK input after the 100 ohm resistor. With either of these capacitors present in the circuit my exorcisor would not work, the clock signal was degraded to the point where it couldn't reach Vih(min). I removed both and it worked like a charm. I recall that Steve's unit would load the clock signal down to about 2.5-2.7V, just enough still to work tho'. I suggest removing them from the design. I also added an internal clock oscillator for self testing and a simple clock detection circuit/indicator along with a +5VDC LED indicator. It turned out that they were well worth the little extra effort to put in. The clock detector is just a 555 in astable mode that is triggered by the START/STOP signal. The oscillator was one of those DIP types at 1MHz. I hope have a tech note finished next week which will show how to debug the Line Length circuit which has that pesky feedback. It will probably be after Thanksgiving. David Fish | "We want...Information. INFORMATION Melrose, MA USA | You won't get it! fishd@tiac.com | By hook or by crook we will" dfish@bev.etn.com | _The Prisoner_ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 21 15:33:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 15:33:35 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 15:34:42 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Note to those building an Exorcisor....anyone? Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Hi Folks, > > Well I got my Exorcisor built and working yesterday and >discovered something important that I think is worth mentioning. >On the schematic there are two capacitors, both 220pF, shown >at the CLOCK input after the 100 ohm resistor. 220pf on a clock? Odd. I wonder if it wasn't supposed to be 22pF... -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 21 16:39:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 16:39:09 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 18:36:21 -0600 Subject: MH Quad POKEY art available Message-ID: <19971121.183636.9366.0.gonzothegreat@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3 From: gonzothegreat@juno.com (Alan J McCormick) Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I finally dug up my PCB artwork for the MH 4xPOKEY board. If anyone wants to get a copy, email me. Virtu-Al From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 23 19:05:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:05:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:05:38 -0500 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: woodcock@dfwmm.net (Gregg Woodcock) Subject: Who is sending me 2 mono XY HV diodes? Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Somebody out there volunteered to send me 2 spare HV diodes for the black and white Atari vector monitors out there but that was several months ago and I don't remember who it is. If it is you, would you please email me an update? From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 23 19:05:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:04:50 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:05:28 -0500 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: woodcock@dfwmm.net (Gregg Woodcock) Subject: Re: Sega Q's Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com At 7:33 11/19/97, Paul Tonizzo wrote: >>At 9:31 11/17/97, Mark Jenison wrote: >>>On Nov 15, 10:47am, Todd Miller wrote: >>>> Subject: Sega Q's >>>> I'm looking for a card cage for the Sega XY, I haven't been able to >find one >>>& was >>>> wondering if they were the same for the raster convert-a-cab ? >>>Yes, the raster and vector games have the same card cage. >>> >>>> If so what what games used them ? >>> >>>Space Odessey (versions 1 and 2), AstroBlaster, Monster Bash and 005. >> >>Are you certain about this? I have been told by many people that they are >>NOT COMPATIBLE! Did you actually do an experiment or see it with your own >>eyes? >They are absolutely 100% compatible. I was running all games (XY and >raster) >out of one cage at one time. AGGGGHHHHHHHHH! All those broken Gorfs I have passed up!!! Oh well, the next one is MINE! :> From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Sun Nov 23 19:21:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:21:02 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:20:59 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Sega Q's Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "AGGGGHHHHHHHHH! All those broken Gorfs I have passed up!!! Oh well, the next one is MINE! :>" um... what does Midway's Gorf have to do with Sega G80 board sets? From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 08:58:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 08:57:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:56:14 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Source/Cross for 74S573 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hey All, I'm trying to fix my Lunar Lander, and I'm pretty sure that I need some 74S573 PROMS. I went to my local surplus store, and in one of life's cruel ironies, they had PLENTY of 74F573s. I jumped for joy, figuring that these were the same thing, because no one would EVER change the functionality of a TTL number, but when I looked these up in IC master, the 74S573 is the PROM, and the 74F573 is some kind of latch. Grrrrr... What I'm trying to figure out is the equivalent 82Sxxx part number so I have more stuff to look for. The 74S573 is a 1024 x 4 PROM, I believe. Is this a 82S137? I forget and have no way to look this stuff up at work.... Anyone know of any good, cheap sources for this chip, or any of its crosses? Thanks, Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------ Joseph J. Welser jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu Design Engineer -- Crystal Semiconductor Corporation Ph.D. Student in E.E. -- University of Texas at Austin Work: jwelser@crystal.cirrus.com http://www.crystal.com P.O. Box 17847; Austin, TX 78760 ------------------------------------------------------------------ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 09:37:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:37:26 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 11:36:45 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Lunar Lander Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Forget about my previous request...It looks like the PROMS can be replaced with 2716s (not directly, of course, but the board can use 2716s,) so I will probably just do that.... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------ Joseph J. Welser jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu Design Engineer -- Crystal Semiconductor Corporation Ph.D. Student in E.E. -- University of Texas at Austin Work: jwelser@crystal.cirrus.com http://www.crystal.com P.O. Box 17847; Austin, TX 78760 ------------------------------------------------------------------ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 09:43:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:43:38 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:44:29 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Source/Cross for 74S573 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Hey All, > > I'm trying to fix my Lunar Lander, and I'm pretty sure that >I need some 74S573 PROMS. I went to my local surplus store, and in >one of life's cruel ironies, they had PLENTY of 74F573s. I jumped >for joy, figuring that these were the same thing, because no one >would EVER change the functionality of a TTL number, but when I >looked these up in IC master, the 74S573 is the PROM, and the >74F573 is some kind of latch. Grrrrr... Hmmmm. I'm on the road today so I can't check, but I'm pretty sure the '573 is a relative of the '373. ICM really says the 74S573 is a PROM? Maybe it's a non-"TTL"-company number? (As in, it's not a TI or a NatSemi 74xxx.) Did ICM give a manufacturer ID for the 74S573? -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 09:46:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:46:39 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:46:36 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Source/Cross for 74S573 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com funny, I was just typing a bipolar cross ref in and was going to send it to vectorlist today 1024 *4 ts 18p 82s137 (sig) 6353 (mmi) 24s41 (ti) 7643 (harris) 27s33 (amd) 74s573 (nat) 93453 (fairchild) mcm7643 (mot) 3625 (intel) I'll check the surplus places today.. problem is finding unprogrammed bipolar parts. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 09:58:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:57:55 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 11:57:19 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Source/Cross for 74S573 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Tue, 25 Nov 1997, Al Kossow wrote: > funny, I was just typing a bipolar cross ref in and was going > to send it to vectorlist today > > 1024 *4 ts 18p 82s137 (sig) 6353 (mmi) 24s41 (ti) 7643 (harris) > 27s33 (amd) 74s573 (nat) 93453 (fairchild) > mcm7643 (mot) 3625 (intel) > > I'll check the surplus places today.. problem is finding unprogrammed > bipolar parts. > That's cool. I have a bunch of 82S137s that I was going to use for the "original" Clay Cowgill SW/ESB hack, but I never got around to it....I know JDR and Jameco still have 82S137s... Thanks! Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 11:08:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 11:07:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199711251907.AA014124836@firewall.dofasco.ca> From: Ranger Mike To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Source/Cross for 74S573 Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:03:00 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com My local supplier seems to have such a beast, but as always, I never count on it until I have them in my hands. Just picked up some 4116's today. www.sayal.com They have a text list of stuff they have in stock (or can get in a day), but they will not order anything not on the list. A little more pricey than the mail order places, but no waiting. They are in southern ontario, and do not do mail order, just thought any Canadians on the list might like to hear this... Mike From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 11:37:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 11:36:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:33:37 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711251933.OAA05127@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Wintron replacement HV transformer for Amplifone Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi, I just called Wintron to order an HV transformer for my Amplifone monitor and the told me the price is $195! It seems like there has been some variation in prices in the prices I have heard from them but it always seemed to be between $155 and $170. Has anyone out there bought one from them recently? What kind of a price did they quote you? I held off from buying it for now but will probably go ahead and buy it if thats my only alternative. BTW, I just got the replacement parts for my deflection board yesterday and I havn't quite completed the job. I'll be trying it out tonight. I'm hoping that one of the HV boards I already have works (I have been told that they are both good) but figure its worth having the Wintron replacement ready even if they do. Dan R. dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 12:01:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 12:01:31 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:00:50 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Wintron replacement HV transformer for Amplifone In-Reply-To: <199711251933.OAA05127@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Tue, 25 Nov 1997, Dan Rasmussen wrote: > Hi, > > I just called Wintron to order an HV transformer for my Amplifone > monitor and the told me the price is $195! It seems like there > has been some variation in prices in the prices I have heard from > them but it always seemed to be between $155 and $170. Has anyone > out there bought one from them recently? What kind of a price did > they quote you? I held off from buying it for now but will probably > go ahead and buy it if thats my only alternative. I bought one in August, and the price was $160. It looks like they raised their prices even more....I spoke with Rose Hutchins when I bought mine, maybe if you spoke with a different person, you might try speaking with her.... Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 12:37:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 12:37:10 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: 25 Nov 1997 15:08 EST To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: "Mark Shostak" Subject: Re: Source/Cross for 74S573 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In message "Source/Cross for 74S573", clayc@diamondmm.com writes: > Hmmmm. I'm on the road today so I can't check, but I'm pretty sure the > '573 is a relative of the '373. ICM really says the 74S573 is a PROM? > Maybe it's a non-"TTL"-company number? (As in, it's not a TI or a NatSemi > 74xxx.) Did ICM give a manufacturer ID for the 74S573? The 74S573 is from the Signetics bipolar PROM series, from the '70s, equivalent to Natl 82Sxx and Harris 54xx, etc. It's not TTL (i.e. glue). The 74F573, as you mentioned, is a younger sibling to the '373 of late '80s vintage. I seem to recall the F indicated the F(ast) series TTL, ironically made by Fairchild. Cheers, Mark From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Tue Nov 25 17:34:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:34:40 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:34:37 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: prom list Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com here is a first pass at a prom reference if someone has the pinouts for the cine roms handy, i'd like to add it (all variants of them) ROM/RAM Reference Guide V1.0 Nov, 1997 Bipolar PROMs ------------- 32*8 +------+ O1 |1 16| Vcc O2 |2 15| CE/ O3 |3 14| A4 O4 |4 13| A3 O5 |5 12| A2 O6 |6 11| A1 O7 |7 10| A0 GND|8 9| O8 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S123 (50ns) 6331-1 18S030 7603-5 - - - - 82S123A(25ns) 63S081 - - - 27S19AC 74S288 - OC 82S23 (50ns) 6330-1 18SA030 7602-5 - 27A18AC 74S188 - 82S23A(25ns) - - - - - - - 256*4 +------+ A6 |1 16| Vcc A5 |2 15| A7 A4 |3 14| CE2/ A3 |4 13| CE1/ A0 |5 12| O1 A1 |6 11| O2 A2 |7 10| O3 GND|8 9| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S129 (50ns) 6301-1 24S10 7611-5 29661 27S21 74S287 3621 82S129A(27ns) 63S141 - 7611A - 27S21A - - OC 82S126 (50ns) 6300-1 24SA10 7610-5 29660 27S20 74S387 3601 82S126A(30ns) 63S140 - 7610A - 27S20A - - 256*8 +------+ A0 |1 20| Vcc A1 |2 19| A7 A2 |3 18| A6 A3 |4 17| A5 A4 |5 16| CE1/ O1 |6 15| CE2/ O2 |7 14| O8 O3 |8 13| O7 O4 |9 12| O6 GND|10 11| O5 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S135 (45ns) 6309-1 18S22 - - - - - 82LS135(100ns)- 28L22 - - - 74LS471 - 512*4 +------+ A6 |1 16| Vcc A5 |2 15| A7 A4 |3 14| A8 A3 |4 13| CE/ A0 |5 12| O1 A1 |6 11| O2 A2 |7 10| O3 GND|8 9| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S131 (50ns) 6306-1 - 7621-5 29611 27S13 74S571 3622 82S131A(30ns) 63S241 - 7621A - 27S13A 74S571A 3622A OC 82S130 (50ns) 6305-1 - 7620-5 29610 27S12 74S570 3602 82S130A(33ns) 63S240 - 7620A-5 - 27S12A 74S570A 3602A 512*8 +------+ A0 |1 20| Vcc A1 |2 19| A8 A2 |3 18| A7 A3 |4 17| A6 A4 |5 16| A5 O1 |6 15| CE/ O2 |7 14| O8 O3 |8 13| O7 O4 |9 12| O6 GND|10 11| O5 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S147 (60ns) 6349-1 28S42 7649-5 29621 - 74S472 - 82S147A(45ns) 6349-2 - 7649A-5 29621A 27S29 74S472A - OC - - - - - - 74S473 512*8 +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| NC A4 |4 21| CE1/ A3 |5 20| CE2/ A2 |6 19| CE3 A1 |7 18| CE4 A0 |8 17| D7 D0 |9 16| D6 D1 |10 15| D5 D2 |11 14| D4 GND|12 13| D3 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S141 6341-1 28S46 7641-5 29625 27S31 74S474 3624 OC - - - - - - - 3604 512*8 (latched) +------+ A3 |1 24| Vcc A4 |2 23| A2 A5 |3 22| A1 A6 |4 21| A0 A7 |5 20| CE1/ A8 |6 19| CE2 O1 |7 18| STROBE O2 |8 17| O8 O3 |9 16| O7 O4 |10 15| O6 FE2|11 14| O5 GND|12 13| FE1 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S115 (60ns) - - - - - - - 1024*4 +------+ A6 |1 18| Vcc A5 |2 17| A7 A4 |3 16| A8 A3 |4 15| A9 A0 |5 14| O1 A1 |6 13| O2 A2 |7 12| O3 CE1/|8 11| O4 GND|9 10| CE2/ +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S137 (60ns) 6353-1 24S41 7643-5 29641 27S33 74S573 3625 82S137A(45ns) 63S441 - 7643A - - 74S573A - 82S137B(35ns) 63S441A - 7643B - 27S33A 74S573B - 1024*8 +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| A9 A4 |4 21| CE1/ A3 |5 20| CE2/ A2 |6 19| CE3 A1 |7 18| CE4 A0 |8 17| O8 O1 |9 16| O7 O2 |10 15| O6 O3 |11 14| O5 GND|12 13| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S181 70ns 6381-1 28S86 7681-5 29631 27S181 - 3628 82S181A 55ns 6381-2 28S86-60 7681A 29631A - 87S181 - 82S181C 30ns 63S881 - - - - 87S181A - 1024*8 (latched) +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| A9 A4 |4 21| CE1/ A3 |5 20| CE2/ A2 |6 19| CE3 A1 |7 18| STROBE A0 |8 17| O8 O1 |9 16| O7 O2 |10 15| O6 O3 |11 14| O5 GND|12 13| O4 +------+ Signetics Fairchild --------- --------- TS 82S183 (60ns) 93L451 2048*4 +------+ A6 |1 18| Vcc A5 |2 17| A7 A4 |3 16| A8 A3 |4 15| A9 A0 |5 14| O1 A1 |6 13| O2 A2 |7 12| O3 A10|8 11| O4 GND|9 10| CE/ +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S185(100ns) - - 7685-5 29651 - - - 82S185A(50ns) 63S841 24S81 7685A 29651A 27S185 87S185 - 82S185B(45ns) - 24S81-55 - - - 87S185A - 2048*8 +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| A9 A4 |4 21| A10 A3 |5 20| CE1/ A2 |6 19| CE2 A1 |7 18| CE3 A0 |8 17| O8 O1 |9 16| O7 O2 |10 15| O6 O3 |11 14| O5 GND|12 13| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S191(80ns) - 28S166 76161 29681 - 87S191 3636B 82S191A(55ns) 63S1681 28S166-55 76161A 29681A 27S191 87S191A - 82S191C(35ns) - - - - 27S191A - - 4096*4 +------+ A8 |1 20| Vcc A7 |2 19| A9 A6 |3 18| A10 A5 |4 17| A11 A4 |5 16| CE1/ A3 |6 15| CE2/ A2 |7 14| O1 A1 |8 13| O2 A0 |9 12| O3 GND|10 11| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Fairchild --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- --------- TS 82S195 (45ns) 63S1641 - 76165-5 - 27S41 87S195 93513 82S195A(35ns) 63S1641A - - 27S41A 87S195A - 82S195B(25ns) - - - - - - - 4096*8 +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| A9 A4 |4 21| A10 A3 |5 20| CE1/ A2 |6 19| A11 A1 |7 18| CE2 A0 |8 17| O8 O1 |9 16| O7 O2 |10 15| O6 O3 |11 14| O5 GND|12 13| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S321 (70ns) - - 76321-5 29671 - - 3632 82HS321(45ns) 63S3281 - - 29671A 27S43 87S321 - 82HS321A(35ns) 63S3281A - - - 27S43A - - 82HS321B(30ns) - - - - - - - 8192*8 +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| A9 A4 |4 21| A10 A3 |5 20| CE1/ A2 |6 19| A11 A1 |7 18| A12 A0 |8 17| O8 O1 |9 16| O7 O2 |10 15| O6 O3 |11 14| O5 GND|12 13| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Fairchild --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- --------- TS 82S641 (55ns) - - 76641-5 - 27S49 - 93Z565 82S641A(45ns) - - 76641A-5 - 27S49A - 93Z565A 82S641B(35ns) - - - - - - - MOS PROMs --------- 2708 2716 TMS2716 9216 2516 +------+ +------+ +------+ +------+ A7 |1 24| Vcc |1 24| Vcc |1 24| Vcc |1 24| Vcc A6 |2 23| A8 |2 23| A8 |2 23| A8 |2 23| A8 A5 |3 22| A9 |3 22| A9 |3 22| A9 |3 22| A9 A4 |4 21| -5v |4 21| Vpp |4 21| -5v |4 21| A10 A3 |5 20| /CE |5 20| /OE |5 20| A10 |5 20| CS1 <-+ (L) A2 |6 19| +12 |6 19| A10 |6 19| +12 |6 19| +12 | A1 |7 18| PGM |7 18| /CE |7 18| S/PGM |7 18| CS2 <-+ (H) A0 |8 17| D7 | | 17| | D0 |9 16| D6 polarity set D1 |10 15| D5 when mask is D2 |11 14| D4 made for ROM GND|12 13| D3 +------+ Midway ROM table from 80-900 CPU drawing Pin MFG No 22 21 19 18 OC ------------------------------------- Intel 2308 A9 -5 +12 COM Intel 2704 COM -5 +12 COM Intel 2708 A9 -5 +12 COM Intel 3304-4 +5 COM +5 +5 yes Intel 3324A +5 COM +5 +5 Intel 3604 +5 COM +5 +5 yes Intel 3624 +5 COM +5 +5 Intel 8308 A9 -5 +12 +5 AMD 9208 A9 - +12 com AMD 9216 A9 A10 +12 +5 AMD 27S80 A9 COM +5 +5 yes AMD 27S81 A9 COM +5 +5 Harris 7640 - COM +5 +5 yes Harris 7641 - COM +5 +5 FSC 93438 - COM +5 +5 yes FSC 93448 - COM +5 +5 Intel 2716 A9 Vpp /OE /CE Game Manuf Used ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ace Major Mfg 3604-4 Blasto Gremlin 6353 U2 U3 U4 U5 6306 U29 U43 Circus Exidy Drag Race Atari 5403 5J 82S129 8L 82S115 0E 0F 0H 0J 0L 0M Robot Bowl Exidy Sprint Atari 82S131 4P 4R 6J 6K 82S129 2M 6331 2E 6353 (optional stuff for pgm) Tornado Baseball Midway 9216 From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 07:50:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 07:50:06 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 07:50:02 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: ROM adapter Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I'm about to lay out a little 24 pin ROM adapter board so that you can read all the weird 2k ROM variants, and wanted to make sure that it can handle the different Cinematronics ROMs too. Does someone have the pinouts handy for the different flavors of ROMs that they used Here is what I have jumperable right now: A9 +5 22 GND A10 GND 21 -5 /CS GND A10 20 +12 A10 19 +5 I also breadboarded a +12/-5 power supply that runs off of the 5v using a Maxim MAX632 (pretty neat little part..) so you should be able to drop this onto any prom programmer that will read 5V 2716's and read everything from 2704's to TMS2716's. ..but I really want to double-check that it works with all the Cine ROMs too From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 08:28:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 08:28:07 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347C6A86.4249@mail.idt.net> Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:29:26 -0800 From: mayday19 X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ROM adapter References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Al Kossow wrote: > > I'm about to lay out a little 24 pin ROM adapter board > so that you can read all the weird 2k ROM variants, and > wanted to make sure that it can handle the different > Cinematronics ROMs too. Does someone have the pinouts > handy for the different flavors of ROMs that they used > Here is what I have jumperable right now: > ..but I really want to double-check that it works > with all the Cine ROMs too cool, I will want one of these (actually for a a friend who burns all my ROMs, and he wants something that will do 2704s and 2708s cause his EMP-20 wont), I want to verify the ROMS on my Speed Freak boardsets. one has 4 2716s and the other has an expansion board mounted up by the sound board and it has 8 2708s on it. both are not working at the moment. I dont know too much about all these older different chip types cause I hardly ever burn any ROMs, but the 2708s (ROM numbers 21 through 27) are labeled like this: B2708/ C2708 AM2708DC except for one of them (ROM number 28)which is labeled: MB8518H will that board will do all these? Jeff -- http://idt.net/~mayday19 From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 08:39:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 08:39:08 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:38:17 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711261638.LAA05602@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: My Amplifone monitor - another update Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hello again, For those that are interested, I got my deflection board together again last night and this time it didn't blow up! I can hear deflection noises but I'm getting a spot killer so I have more problems to chase down. I also tried the first of the HV boards and it seems to be dead (loud squeal, no monitor activity at all - no crackles, no heater). I have a new -24V reuglator for the second, supposedly working, HV board and I'm going to steal a resistor I need off the first HV board to fix up the second well enough to give it a try. If it works, I'm hoping I can figure out which side of the deflcetion board has the problem. Meanwhile, I have decided to bite the bullet and get the Wintron HV transformer for the new price, $195 (ouch). Thanks again for all the help. Dan R. dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 08:48:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 08:48:19 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 08:48:16 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ROM adapter Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "cool, I will want one of these (actually for a a friend who burns all my ROMs, and he wants something that will do 2704s and 2708s cause his EMP-20 wont)" This won't let you PROGRAM a 3 voltage EPROM, just read them. The cheapest thing to do is pick up a used Data I/O model 19 or 29 programmer just for the older parts. They have been around for under $100. If anyone needs one, Haltek Electronics in Sunnyvale has a 29B with a UniPak 2 for $175. I also just discovered that neither the 29 or the fancy UniSites support TMS2716's.. I ended up lifting the pin on a wirewrap socket and reading them as 2708's and toggling A10 by hand. Not related to vector stuff, but i'm discovering that is really tough to deal with older Atari game ROMs. Here is an example of the pinout of the program and sprite ROMs in Drag Race: GND CS A0 D A1 D A2 D A3 D A4 D A5 D A9 D +5 D A8 CS A7 CS A6 CS ..weird Atari also used 82S115's, which are non-JEDEC latched bipolar proms. Here's a weird idea I had last night.. I'm working on a PCI card for my real job, and one of the things I was going to do is put a flash ROM programmer on it, using an external box with a ZIF socket. The interface is just some parallel latches with the CPU doing all the signal wiggling. As I'm drawing this up, it occurs to me that CPUs are fast enough now that you should be able to simulate all the processor timing of an 8 bit micro in software and build a "soft ICE" that could plug into the microprocessor socket and simulate a Z80, 8080, 6502, etc.. I built something sort of like that when I was trying to figure out how the Battlezone mathbox worked; I built an interface to the mathbox board that talked to Eric Smith's vector simulator which would accept mathbox commands from the simulator. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 09:08:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:08:12 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:07:37 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Zektor marquee Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hey all, I'm still in disbelief that Paul Frazee. sold out all his Zektor marquees in one morning (without selling multiples to somebody,) so, if any of you guys managed to pick up more than one, and wants to re-sell it, drop me an email, and name your price. Thanks, Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------ Joseph J. Welser jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu Design Engineer -- Crystal Semiconductor Corporation Ph.D. Student in E.E. -- University of Texas at Austin Work: jwelser@crystal.cirrus.com http://www.crystal.com P.O. Box 17847; Austin, TX 78760 ------------------------------------------------------------------ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 09:18:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:17:56 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:17:21 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ROM adapter In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 26 Nov 1997, Al Kossow wrote: > I also just discovered that neither the 29 or the fancy > UniSites support TMS2716's.. I ended up lifting the pin > on a wirewrap socket and reading them as 2708's and > toggling A10 by hand. > Does anybody know which programers DID support TMS2716s? It seems like a programmer that does ALL the old stuff (2708s, TMS2716s, old Bipolar stuff, etc) has become one of my "Holy Grails" of video game collecting.....There had to be SOME programmer that did them all... Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 09:45:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:45:54 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: ROM adapter To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:09:45 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu" at Nov 26, 97 11:17:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347c65e90.6552@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 678 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > > I also just discovered that neither the 29 or the fancy > > UniSites support TMS2716's.. I ended up lifting the pin > > on a wirewrap socket and reading them as 2708's and > > toggling A10 by hand. > > > > Does anybody know which programers DID support TMS2716s? > > It seems like a programmer that does ALL the old stuff (2708s, > TMS2716s, old Bipolar stuff, etc) has become one of my "Holy Grails" of > video game collecting.....There had to be SOME programmer that did them > all... I think my Andromeda one will do everything (sometimes you have to build the right adapter, but they are pretty easy). As I recall they even sell an adapter to burn 1702s.. Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 09:54:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:53:59 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:53:56 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Andromeda programmer Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "I think my Andromeda one will do everything (sometimes you have to build the right adapter, but they are pretty easy). As I recall they even sell an adapter to burn 1702s.." cool. just did an altavista search, here is a scan of their add http://cinecam.com/andromed.htm they have TMS2716 and 1702 adapters.. i'll probably be ordering one today (They're $289..) i'll let everyone know how much the adapters are. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 10:19:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:19:29 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 18:21:16 GMT Message-ID: <34836343.409650963@tommy.doctord.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:53:56 -0800 (PST), aek@goonsquad.spies.com (Al Kossow) wrote: > >"I think my Andromeda one will do everything (sometimes you have to = build the >right adapter, but they are pretty easy). As I recall they even sell an >adapter to burn 1702s.." > >cool. just did an altavista search, here is a scan of their add > >http://cinecam.com/andromed.htm > >they have TMS2716 and 1702 adapters.. i'll probably be ordering one >today (They're $289..) > >i'll let everyone know how much the adapters are. I own the same one. It comes with a complete schematic - including schematics to allow you to build your own adapters, which is nice. It also comes with some of the worst software written for a programmer. But once you wade through the menus and say "yes I'm sure" a lot, you can eventually burn an EPROM. I used to think Needhams software was a pain!! One thing that is not apparent, in the add, is that there are switch settings that must be setup for each different type of EPROM, along with selecting the proper EPROM from the software menu -- an extra step most universal programmers have done away with using a few switching transistors. Automating it (placing it in a batch file) is a pain since they alternate between BIOS calls and DOS calls. Trying to use one of those programs that fools the software into reading command lines as key sequences won't always work because of the lame software. It's like some Jr. High School kid's software project untitled: "My =46irst GUI" though it's not GUI, but text based. Either way it burns about everything (with the proper adapters, and switches set). Comes in a nice carrying case, and plugs into anyone's parallel port (doesn't need an adapter card -- way cool for going to someone's house and grabbing ROM images) And the cheapest I found that allows for doing these things. Given time I'd re-write the interface software...of course givin' time (and a little money) I'd build a three colored, laser projected, X/Y platform, with a 50,000 watt audio sound system, and play Tempest projected against the side of the Grand Canyon. Hmmm... time to check those lotto numbers... -Z <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 10:29:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:29:19 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 18:31:07 GMT Message-ID: <34846964.411221096@tommy.doctord.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:53:56 -0800 (PST), aek@goonsquad.spies.com (Al Kossow) wrote: > >"I think my Andromeda one will do everything (sometimes you have to = build the >right adapter, but they are pretty easy). As I recall they even sell an >adapter to burn 1702s.." > >cool. just did an altavista search, here is a scan of their add > >http://cinecam.com/andromed.htm What the hell is this page you found Al? Geeze! Everything is on the Net huh? How to clone cellular phones? The funniest lines on the page are: "NOTE: Check with an attorney in your area to see if this procedure is legal or not." Then paragraph telling you how much you should charge for your services: "HOW MUCH TO CHARGE: The going rate to clone one phone of the same type to another is approximately $100.00 to $200.00 depending upon the difficulty involved. The smaller the phone the more difficult it is to clone because of surface mount parts. We suggest starting on easier models such as Radio-Shack cellular telephones first. Cloning two identical phones is easier than cross-cloning two different phones. The more work required, the higher the price, typically." Which is followed by: "all material for educational use only" So boys and girls, what have we learned in class today? =46unny. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 10:34:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:34:29 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:34:26 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com "So boys and girls, what have we learned in class today?" Alta vista searches are fun? So would you please tell me what the pinouts are for the Cine proms.. pleeese? From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 10:44:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:44:53 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-CriticalPath-Timestamp: 26 Nov 1997 18:43:38 GMT Message-ID: <347C6C8A.1B11@netconx.net> Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 12:38:02 -0600 From: Todd Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ROM adapter References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Al Kossow wrote: > > The cheapest thing to do is pick up a used Data I/O model 19 or > 29 programmer just for the older parts. They have been around > for under $100. If anyone needs one, Haltek Electronics in > Sunnyvale has a 29B with a UniPak 2 for $175. > I have the software, Promlink 2.01 for anyone who wants it. It's a dos app that works w/Data I/O models 19, 22, 29, 60 & 120/121. It's only 61k zipped up, LMK if you want me to e-mail it to you. -- Thanks Todd FWIW: I have changed ISP's old: www.willowtree.com/~litterbox litterbox@willowtree.com new: www.netconx.net/~litterbox litterbox@netconx.net From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 10:54:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:54:42 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 18:56:29 GMT Message-ID: <34856ec4.412597077@tommy.doctord.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 26 Nov 1997 10:34:26 -0800 (PST), aek@goonsquad.spies.com (Al Kossow) wrote: >"So boys and girls, what have we learned in class today?" > >Alta vista searches are fun? > >So would you please tell me what the pinouts are for >the Cine proms.. pleeese? I saw your original post, and it's not like I'm keeping things secret. I have an adapter that will read the strange PROMs used by Sundance. The thing is I'll be damned if remember the pinout. We just started "trying things" based on the schematic, and one combination finally worked. What I'm going to have to do is: #1) Find the adapter. #2) Trace the pinouts. There was also an invertor on the adapter, but I can't remember if we used it or not, I don't think it ended up being needed. It was a combination that *was* shown on the schematic though. I'll figure things out this weekend and let you know. I would like a nice PCB for reading Cinematronics ROMs. The different PROM variations (and there were a few) werE all available, off the shelve parts, and if you build a board to read these I'm sure it would come in handy for other games. I think you could read all the variations of ROMs with three dual setup jumpers, or 6 DIP switches, or something. I'll let you know. -Z <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 11:04:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:04:39 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 12:28:22 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "Al Kossow" at Nov 26, 97 09:53:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347c78560.684f@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1251 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > "I think my Andromeda one will do everything (sometimes you have to build the > right adapter, but they are pretty easy). As I recall they even sell an > adapter to burn 1702s.." > > cool. just did an altavista search, here is a scan of their add > > http://cinecam.com/andromed.htm > > they have TMS2716 and 1702 adapters.. i'll probably be ordering one > today (They're $289..) > > i'll let everyone know how much the adapters are. I have to agree with Zonn that the software is CRAP. The guy that I ordered it from raved about his new version (which he sent me).. It wasn't as bad as the old software, but it still sucked. He talked about it being better than the Needham software. Well, maybe I'm biased because I've been using the Needham software for so many years, but I have to disagree. Most of the adapters are pretty cheap. Seems like the 1702 adapter was horrendously expensive (but with all those voltages.. yuck).. The bipolar prom adapter wasn't too bad but you have to build all of these jumper blocks for the various proms.. If you want to build your own adapter those are pretty easy too. It sure is nice getting complete schematics for the unit AND all the adapter modules (even the ones you didn't buy).. Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 11:16:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:16:20 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 12:40:23 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: <34856ec4.412597077@tommy.doctord.com> from "Zonn" at Nov 26, 97 06:56:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347c7b270.68eb@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 288 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > >So would you please tell me what the pinouts are for > >the Cine proms.. pleeese? Seems like Rick had a trick for reading the roms too. Somewhere in my email archives I've got the mail of the various tricks he would use. (just keep trying until some valid data comes out.. :) Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 11:23:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:23:00 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) From: zonn@concentric.net (Zonn) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 19:24:49 GMT Message-ID: <348674b1.414113593@tommy.doctord.com> References: <347c78560.684f@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> In-Reply-To: <347c78560.684f@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Wed, 26 Nov 1997 12:28:22 -0700 (MST), "Kurt Mahan" wrote: >> "I think my Andromeda one will do everything (sometimes you have to = build the >> right adapter, but they are pretty easy). As I recall they even sell = an >> adapter to burn 1702s.." >>=20 >> cool. just did an altavista search, here is a scan of their add >>=20 >> http://cinecam.com/andromed.htm >>=20 >> they have TMS2716 and 1702 adapters.. i'll probably be ordering one >> today (They're $289..) >>=20 >> i'll let everyone know how much the adapters are. > >I have to agree with Zonn that the software is CRAP. The guy that I = ordered >it from raved about his new version (which he sent me).. It wasn't as = bad >as the old software, but it still sucked. He talked about it being = better >than the Needham software. Well, maybe I'm biased because I've been = using >the Needham software for so many years, but I have to disagree.=20 Yeah! I got the same line when I was buying the thing, about how much better there software was the Needham's! It has nothing to do with how long you used Needham's, Andromeda software sucks! It was obviously not written by someone who writes software for a living. (Should I be asking you for the newest version? I can't remember the version of the software I have.)=20 >Most of the adapters are pretty cheap. Seems like the 1702 adapter was >horrendously expensive (but with all those voltages.. yuck).. The = bipolar >prom adapter wasn't too bad but you have to build all of these jumper=20 >blocks for the various proms.. I also bought the bipolar adapter. It's basically a stand alone bipolar programmer that is controlled through the address/data lines of the programmer (don't attempt to build one of these, just buy the thing!) It works, and for as often as one really needs to burn these old parts, it works fine. The jumpers are a pain, but I found some headers at a surplus shop that allowed me to place them all on one header. Not too bad. >If you want to build your own adapter those are pretty easy too. > >It sure is nice getting complete schematics for the unit AND all the = adapter >modules (even the ones you didn't buy).. That's what actually sold me on the thing. -Zonn <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ------ ___ Member of A.A.C.S.: |---- | ( ) Association for Artistically / / ( () ) Challenged Signatures / / //\\ // (__) / ---/ // \\ //\\ // zonn @ concentric . net -------| // \\/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 11:42:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:42:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:43:06 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Development stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Mr. Genius here (me) took yesterday off from work and forgot that the Sega Multigame boards were coming FedEx, so I missed 'em. *Duhhhhh*... I should have them today. On to the real reason I was writing this. As I was driving around yesterday I thought of another little PCB I want to do, but since it might be of "general" interest I figure I'd bring it up here... I have this major hacked-up method of testing boards involving aligator clips and a PC power supply and some card edge connectors. I decided it would be nice to make a little adapter that has 2 or three card-edge connectors on it with every line brought out on a heavy trace on the PCB and terminating at a test-point post. On the same PCB have a connector for a "PC" type switching power supply and a "generic" video connector, control connector, and Audio connector with a little audio amp. Maybe something like: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA +------------------+ | |B | |B | |B | |B | |B | PWR RGB CONT AUD |B +------------------+ A = 56 pin .156" connector B = 44/36 pin .156" connector PWR = .156" power connector post to match PC-AT power supply RGB = DB-9 pin connector CONT = DB-25 pin connector (two joysticks, six buttons, p1/p2 start, coins, etc) AUD = Speaker and Line-level outputs So you just plug it into the cardedge of a board and use little alligator-clip jumpers to connect your voltages, controls, and signals where needed. It's not exactly an "innovation" or anything, I just think it'd be a much nicer (for me anyway) way of testing "unknown" boards. Actually... Now that I think about it... I could put a couple of headers in the middle of the board and allow for little "personality" modules to be plugged in. (So you could have half a dozen "common" adapters-- Nintendo Donkey Kong Type, Konami type, Capcom 56 pin, etc. for quick tests that would hook up the video, controls, and power automatically...) Ehhh, just a thought. :-) -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 11:46:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:46:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:46:10 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Development stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com those would be handy. I keep cutting the ends off of PC supplies and putting 15 pin AMP connectors on them to mate up with the G80 card cages.. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 11:59:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:59:17 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 14:58:43 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711261958.OAA05849@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com CC: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In-reply-to: (message from Clay Cowgill on Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:43:06 -0800) Subject: Re: Development stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > I have this major hacked-up method of testing boards involving aligator > clips and a PC power supply and some card edge connectors. > I thought I was the only one that tested boards like this :)... Sign me up for one of these right now. How about adding an inverter for for raster sync signals (put it on a switch or provide terminals for inverted and non-inverted sync.). Dan R. dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 12:32:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 12:32:39 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Development stuff... To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 13:56:23 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "Clay Cowgill" at Nov 26, 97 11:43:06 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347c8cf70.6b81@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1333 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > On to the real reason I was writing this. As I was driving around > yesterday I thought of another little PCB I want to do, but since it might > be of "general" interest I figure I'd bring it up here... Cool -- sign me up for a couple. Can I ask for a few things on it? Lots of +5 and GND connect area. Seems like some of the boards I've been working on just require a lot (multiboard sets, etc..) Currently I get this growing "chain" of jumpers.. 3 audio amps (I've never seen a game need over three -- gorf/wizofwor/etc do need three though -- left/right/voice) Inputs for CSYNC, VSYNC and HSYNC (combine V&H) and also have an inverter for the sync. I use a '86 as I recall to combine, and an '04 to invert in my little "does everything" video board. I've just got 2 switches on the board, one for sync select (C, or H+V) and one for invert. It would be cool to allow a little plug in module to invert the RGB too (for those that might have to test nintendo stuff -- paul kahler had a nice little analog inverter circuit). I know -- we take a cool little project and make it grow. Have you ever seen a PAT9000? (an Atari test piece). VERY impressive. (and as my old roommate would say "Lots of switches and lights!") If anybody knows where I can get one (doesn't have to be working) I'd be very happy.. Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 12:38:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 12:38:00 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Andromeda programmer To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 14:01:38 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: <348674b1.414113593@tommy.doctord.com> from "Zonn" at Nov 26, 97 07:24:49 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347c8e320.6bc4@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1570 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > Yeah! I got the same line when I was buying the thing, about how much > better there software was the Needham's! It has nothing to do with how > long you used Needham's, Andromeda software sucks! It was obviously not > written by someone who writes software for a living. > > (Should I be asking you for the newest version? I can't remember the > version of the software I have.) Seems like I've got version 5 (just from memory, I bought mine a year or so ago). > I also bought the bipolar adapter. It's basically a stand alone bipolar > programmer that is controlled through the address/data lines of the > programmer (don't attempt to build one of these, just buy the thing!) > It works, and for as often as one really needs to burn these old parts, > it works fine. The jumpers are a pain, but I found some headers at a > surplus shop that allowed me to place them all on one header. Not too > bad. I've been building using a couple of machine sockets tied together. It should be pointed out that while the bipolar board will burn just about anything sometimes the voltages have to be adjusted. And they thoughtfully provided pots and test points to do it (but you need a vom to do the adjust).. Aside from having to build my own headers I've been very happy with it as a bipolar burner (I still use my emp-20 for most eproms).. One cool feature of the software is the ability to convert from 1 bit/byte when reading the prom to a 8 bit/byte packed format (it converts either way). Wasn't the bipolar adapter like ~$100 or so? Well worth it. Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 14:15:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 14:15:13 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) X-Sender: clay@supra.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 14:16:15 -0800 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com From: Clay Cowgill Subject: Re: Development stuff... Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com >Cool -- sign me up for a couple. Can I ask for a few things on it? Sounds good... I'm trolling for input... >Lots of +5 and GND connect area. Seems like some of the boards I've been >working on just require a lot (multiboard sets, etc..) Currently I get this >growing "chain" of jumpers.. Yep. I agree there. It's part of my reason for doing this-- thin jumper wires don't carry enough current to really power big boardsets like Pole Position, I,Robot, etc... >3 audio amps (I've never seen a game need over three -- gorf/wizofwor/etc >do need three though -- left/right/voice) Ah. Ok, hadn't thought of that. I can either combine them into a single channel (it *is* just a tester :), or put down three amps. I'm planning on using the little LM386 since we use millions of 'em in our modems and they're really cheap for me to get. I could even put a little speaker on the board actually... >Inputs for CSYNC, VSYNC and HSYNC (combine V&H) and also have an inverter >for the sync. I use a '86 as I recall to combine, and an '04 to invert >in my little "does everything" video board. I've just got 2 switches on >the board, one for sync select (C, or H+V) and one for invert. You can actually do all that in one 74LS86. One switch sets output polarity with the last XOR gate, the other gates combine the H and Vsync. I did this for my monitor tester... >It would be cool to allow a little plug in module to invert the RGB too >(for those that might have to test nintendo stuff -- paul kahler had a nice >little analog inverter circuit). That's easy enough too. A pair of LF353's will work fine. (Another part we buy in the millions, so they're cheap... :-) >I know -- we take a cool little project and make it grow. I don't think that's too much to ask. I need to think about the best way to do it now is all... >Have you ever seen a PAT9000? (an Atari test piece). VERY impressive. >(and as my old roommate would say "Lots of switches and lights!") I've never seen one. :-( Anybody have pictures? -Clay Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager _______________________________________________________________________ /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Wed Nov 26 20:04:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 20:03:45 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Subject: Re: Development stuff... To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 21:28:04 -0700 (MST) From: "Kurt Mahan" In-Reply-To: from "Clay Cowgill" at Nov 26, 97 02:16:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID: <347cf6d50.507@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1349 Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com > You can actually do all that in one 74LS86. One switch sets output > polarity with the last XOR gate, the other gates combine the H and Vsync. > I did this for my monitor tester... About that monitor tester.. :) > >Have you ever seen a PAT9000? (an Atari test piece). VERY impressive. > >(and as my old roommate would say "Lots of switches and lights!") > > I've never seen one. :-( Anybody have pictures? Basically its composed of three pieces. The control console and two 13" monitors (one raster and one vector). The control console is a couple feet in length, about 10" high and 10" deep (this is from memory). If you find one make sure to get all possible cable harnesses for it. These things are typically broken when they are being gotten rid of, but are trivial to fix (just time consuming -- this was engineered in the "functionality is more important than cost..") An example is the joystick/trackball section. Rather than have a microswitch joystick, an analog joystick and a trackball they have just one analog joystick. They have logic that converts its outputs to anything necessary (plus maps it to up to 4 different control inputs).. Another suggestion for the board -- scope probe hookup loops on the video sections and the audio sections. Those seem to be the main places I stick probes on the outputs... Kurt From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 08:03:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 08:02:51 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347D65F1.495D@erols.com> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 04:22:09 -0800 From: Kev X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Development stuff... References: <347cf6d50.507@bolt.usg.provo.novell.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com aHmm hard to please everyone on this one. I use 2 harnesses as the basis for my test fixtures, Pac-Man with AC and JAMMA. Things that I'd like to see... Outputs to a JAMMA male plug (this way I could plug up to most newer cabinets & use them as a test fixture when traveling). And input of JAMMA too but if you do this make a switch to lift -5VDC as some boards have problems with this. What about a tri colored led for +5 Voltage, kinda cheesy but quick & dirty. (I've dreamed about ampmeters on all voltage lines but that is a bit much...) What about a led indicator and reset watchdog, just a clip that could could grab the reset line and monitor for a state change, convenient for burnin testing to see if the game crashes. B&W (composite video). input to RGB output. Yes, 3 audio amps. JAMMA is set up for 1 speaker, stereo is a ad on to JAMMA but not standard.... So speakers or switchable audio out would be good. Will there be a provision for XY outputs to monitors or Scope? I think I have PAT 9000 drawings if they help, but looking at them there really isn't much else there that we haven't covered. I liked AL's mention of the ICE for older CPU's, now if we could create a PC board that would take the edge connector and put it up on the screen with the ICE running or another unit strobing inputs & reading outputs.....fully automated tester! -- Kev http://www.erols.com/mowerman <- Coin Op Video Game site REMOVE "?" FROM MY E-MAIL Looking for any Pac Man info & a few good PCBs... From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 16:44:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 16:40:58 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347E12DD.5C7284F2@istar.com> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 16:39:57 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ROM adapter References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BadReturnPath: pinball@istar.com rewritten as jrr@flippers.com using "Reply-to" header Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com The only programmer that did all the early stuff is one of DATA IO's models...I don't remember the unit number but it seemed that everyone of the electronics wholesellers had them back then... John :-#)# jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > > On Wed, 26 Nov 1997, Al Kossow wrote: > > > I also just discovered that neither the 29 or the fancy > > UniSites support TMS2716's.. I ended up lifting the pin > > on a wirewrap socket and reading them as 2708's and > > toggling A10 by hand. > > > > Does anybody know which programers DID support TMS2716s? > > It seems like a programmer that does ALL the old stuff (2708s, > TMS2716s, old Bipolar stuff, etc) has become one of my "Holy Grails" of > video game collecting.....There had to be SOME programmer that did them > all... > > Joe -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr@flippers.com, web page http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 16:51:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 16:51:37 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347E1556.6AF05E90@istar.com> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 16:50:31 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Development stuff... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BadReturnPath: pinball@istar.com rewritten as jrr@flippers.com using "Reply-to" header Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hmmm, I have one of those PAT 9000's...would you like a picture? I actually have never used it, I use the older Atari Orange test fixture quite successfully. And have spare plugs for it too. Perhaps, someday, I should make a list of the test equipment I have that I am interested in trading for other stuff??? John :-#)# Clay Cowgill wrote: > > >Cool -- sign me up for a couple. Can I ask for a few things on it? > > Sounds good... I'm trolling for input... > > >Lots of +5 and GND connect area. Seems like some of the boards I've been > >working on just require a lot (multiboard sets, etc..) Currently I get this > >growing "chain" of jumpers.. > > Yep. I agree there. It's part of my reason for doing this-- thin jumper > wires don't carry enough current to really power big boardsets like Pole > Position, I,Robot, etc... > > >3 audio amps (I've never seen a game need over three -- gorf/wizofwor/etc > >do need three though -- left/right/voice) > > Ah. Ok, hadn't thought of that. I can either combine them into a single > channel (it *is* just a tester :), or put down three amps. I'm planning on > using the little LM386 since we use millions of 'em in our modems and > they're really cheap for me to get. I could even put a little speaker on > the board actually... > > >Inputs for CSYNC, VSYNC and HSYNC (combine V&H) and also have an inverter > >for the sync. I use a '86 as I recall to combine, and an '04 to invert > >in my little "does everything" video board. I've just got 2 switches on > >the board, one for sync select (C, or H+V) and one for invert. > > You can actually do all that in one 74LS86. One switch sets output > polarity with the last XOR gate, the other gates combine the H and Vsync. > I did this for my monitor tester... > > >It would be cool to allow a little plug in module to invert the RGB too > >(for those that might have to test nintendo stuff -- paul kahler had a nice > >little analog inverter circuit). > > That's easy enough too. A pair of LF353's will work fine. (Another part > we buy in the millions, so they're cheap... :-) > > >I know -- we take a cool little project and make it grow. > > I don't think that's too much to ask. I need to think about the best way > to do it now is all... > > >Have you ever seen a PAT9000? (an Atari test piece). VERY impressive. > >(and as my old roommate would say "Lots of switches and lights!") > > I've never seen one. :-( Anybody have pictures? > > -Clay > > Clayton N. Cowgill Engineering Manager > _______________________________________________________________________ > /\ Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc. clay@supra.com > \/ Communications Division http://www.supra.com/ -- John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr@flippers.com, web page http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 17:16:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 17:16:00 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347E16FB.642691D6@istar.com> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 16:57:31 -0800 From: John Robertson Organization: John's Jukes Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com" Subject: Some vector games for sale... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BadReturnPath: pinball@istar.com rewritten as jrr@flippers.com using "Reply-to" header Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hmm let's see, what to clear out. Atari Space Duel cocktail Atari Tempest Cocktail Atari Battlezone Cabaret Atari Battlezone fullsize (!) Sega Star Trek in a Tempset U/R cabinet. Exidy Tailgunner II in a cockpit Atari Star Wars in a cockpit Cinematronics/Vectorbeam Barrier (Jwelser has his eye on this one) There must be one or two more hiding here... I really need the space here, and so am open to offers. This stuff all works, perhaps a package deal??? John :-#)# John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) mailto:jrr@flippers.com, web page http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 20:44:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 20:44:21 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 22:43:47 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Lunar Lander help... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hey all, I've got a Lunar Lander which I've pretty much brought back to life, but the last remaining problem is that the game only displays the Lower-Left quadrant of the screen. I don't know that the monitor is good, but I HAVE swapped in 4 new deflection transistors (the 2N3716 and 2N3792s) and that had no effect. The game passes all self tests, and plays, but with only 1/4 of the screen. I've checked all the voltages, and +5, +5 DAC, +15, and -15 are all good. I touched up most, if not all of the solder joints on the deflection board, the monitor regulator board, and the AVG part of the game board. I'm pretty much convinced that this is an AVG problem, but I thought I remembered someone posting a fix for this sometime, somewhere. Thanks for any help... Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 21:07:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 21:07:03 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 00:06:17 -0500 (EST) From: "Christopher X. Candreva" To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Lunar Lander help... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Thu, 27 Nov 1997 jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > I've checked all the voltages, and +5, +5 DAC, +15, and -15 > are all good. I touched up most, if not all of the solder joints on > the deflection board, the monitor regulator board, and the AVG part of > the game board. Beg, borrow, or steal a scope. You can use it in XY mode to look at the picuture, you can check the waveforms -- your best diagnostic tool, IMHO. -Chris ========================================================== Chris Candreva -- chris@westnet.com -- (914) 967-7816 WestNet Internet Services of Westchester http://www.westnet.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 21:09:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 21:09:30 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 00:08:43 -0500 (EST) From: "Christopher X. Candreva" To: "vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com" Subject: Re: Some vector games for sale... In-Reply-To: <347E16FB.642691D6@istar.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Thu, 27 Nov 1997, John Robertson wrote: > Hmm let's see, what to clear out. > Sega Star Trek in a Tempset U/R cabinet. > Atari Star Wars in a cockpit > John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Sigh -- isn't there anyone else in the NY area ?? I didn't want them anyway. I prefer non-working games. Yeah -- that's the ticket. -Chris ========================================================== Chris Candreva -- chris@westnet.com -- (914) 967-7816 WestNet Internet Services of Westchester http://www.westnet.com/ From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 21:32:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 21:32:24 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347E5745.7D79@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:31:49 -0600 From: RWood54741@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-WorldNet (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Zektor References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com I am unclear about whether a surviving Zektor is known to exist. Would someone please get me up to speed about this. Are any whole Zektor cabinets known? Bob Wood From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 21:54:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 21:54:40 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:54:05 -0600 (CST) From: X-Sender: jwelser@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Zektor In-Reply-To: <347E5745.7D79@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com On Thu, 27 Nov 1997 RWood54741@worldnet.att.net wrote: > I am unclear about whether a surviving Zektor is > known to exist. Would someone please get me up to > speed about this. Are any whole Zektor cabinets known? > > Bob Wood I think someone posted on RGVAC that "Rick S." (Rick Schieve?) had one. Did Zektor have side-art? I think the picture in the "new" KLOV showed that it did. Else, there's no such think as a "Zektor cabinet," just a G-80 cabinet with all the Zektor stuff in it (marquee, bezel, control panel, boards...) Joe From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 22:12:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 22:11:59 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-ID: <347E608E.24D5@worldnet.att.net> Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 00:11:26 -0600 From: RWood54741@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-WorldNet (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Zektor References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com jwelser@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu wrote: > > On Thu, 27 Nov 1997 RWood54741@worldnet.att.net wrote: > > > I am unclear about whether a surviving Zektor is > > known to exist. Would someone please get me up to > > speed about this. Are any whole Zektor cabinets known? > > > > Bob Wood > > I think someone posted on RGVAC that "Rick S." (Rick Schieve?) had > one. > > Did Zektor have side-art? I think the picture in the "new" KLOV > showed that it did. Else, there's no such think as a "Zektor cabinet," > just a G-80 cabinet with all the Zektor stuff in it (marquee, bezel, > control panel, boards...) > > Joe No, there is no side art in the several pics I have seen of it. It may be about time to thinkabout having the marquee, overlay and bezel made. BTW, Ed Johnson has been told he has to vacate his building by February. If you still want those games over there we will discount them a little further. It's either that or I will probably have to bring them over here to my warehouse. Let me know. BOB From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Thu Nov 27 22:25:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 22:25:55 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 22:25:52 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: Zektor Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Gaymond Lee said in a recent RGVAC posting that an operator he knows has one. From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 28 04:57:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 04:57:01 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: <199711281256.AA150951792@firewall.dofasco.ca> From: Ranger Mike To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Subject: Re: ROM adapter Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 07:52:00 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Hi all... I work at a large steel mill with many electonics shops, and have been able to borrow "until we need it again, but havent used it in 9 years" a DIGELEC 824 programmer. It doesn't claim to do bipolars, but then again I'm not up to speed on all the numbers. It will go down as far as 2758,2716 and up to about 27512, along with EEPROMS and 87 series. It seems an update we got for it tells me it will do the 74s474, so I may try to do a williams video decoder for fun. Just got it this week, and will be playing with it in the next few, but I really wanted to program a 27020, but they would not let me borrow the "good" programmer!!! guess I will have to bring the chip in and do it at lunch. I wonder if any upgrades were made to the chip list for the 824 to allow a 27020. Runs in my mind that i could program 512 K at a time with a little adapter...HMmmmm. Mike From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 28 07:09:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 07:09:22 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 10:08:35 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711281508.KAA06467@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> From: Dan Rasmussen To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com In-reply-to: <199711261638.LAA05602@rasmussen.telco.stratus.com> (message from Dan Rasmussen on Wed, 26 Nov 1997 11:38:17 -0500 (EST)) Subject: My Amplifone monitor - last update Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Last night I got my Amplifone monitor working. The boards had lots of problems but with the help of people on this list I managed to get them fixed. Anyway, here's a summary of the problems: Two HV boards: one looked good and I put a cap kit into it but it was dead (very noisy, no action in the tube). The second one had a jumper wire across the -24V regulator, I replace the regulator and put a 50 ohm resistor where the jumper wire was. I also replaced most of the electrolytic caps on the board. This board turned out to be good as the trader told me. Deflection board: Many fried resistors (R31, R30, R28, R35, R36). I replaced all these resistors and put a Zannen kit into it (I also replaced C13 which was burnt by R30). Fired it up and refired most of the same resistors again. Further investigation showed that that Q15 had shorted to the heat sink due to a problem with the insulator. I then replaced all of Q4, Q5, Q14, and Q15. Fired it up again and was getting spot killer. I turned up the brightness and was getting Y deflection. Pulled the board again and found that F2 had blown. I checked all the transistors on the X side (in-circuit) and found that Q11 and Q12 were short across the emitter and collector in both directions. I replaced them (after verifying they had problems after removal). Replaced the fuse and all was well. Getting this monitor working was a good feeling as this is my first vector game. I used to play Star Wars at the U-Mass, Amherst, campus center and dining commons in 84. Its great to now own a working game. Now I need a tempest. If anyone has a fixer-uper for sale (I don't need the boards), just a cab w/o boards and a dead monitor would be a good start for me. I'm hoping to find something with good side art that I could get delivered via forward air for around $200 (wishful thinking?). Thanks again for all the help. Dan R. dras@sw.stratus.com From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 28 12:53:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 12:53:29 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 12:53:26 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Subject: Italian Cinematronics Game Boards Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Someone from Sweden posted a couple of Italian Rip Off boards a couple of weeks ago so I thought they might be interesting to look at. It turns out one of them is a Star Castle (called Space Fortress) and one is unmarked (haven't read the EPROMS in yet to see if they're different) The CPU board is the same one we all know (and love?) but the other boards are completely different layouts. The REALLY interesting thing is this company didn't use the Cine monitor design THE ANALOG SECTION IS ON THE SOUND BOARD! and they designed their own power supply and X/Y monitor (at least the monitor schematic has all SGS part numbers for the transistors) He included a water-damaged copy of the Space Fortress manual and schematics too, so I'll try to get them scanned in and up on spies. There are two different vector generators on the sound boards (actually two different designs on the two different sound boards I have to compare) One used DAC-80's and one used National DAC-1221's The star castle copy doesn't have any board markings on it the other has this on the CPU and sound/vg board: Elettronolo - VETTOR1 Elettronolo - FIRENZE From goonsquad.spies.com!owner-vectorlist Fri Nov 28 22:30:28 1997 Return-Path: Received: by goonsquad.spies.com via sendmail with stdio id for vectorlist-outgoing; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 22:29:34 -0800 (PST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #5 built 1996-Dec-13) Message-Id: Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 22:29:31 -0800 (PST) From: aek (Al Kossow) To: vectorlist Sender: owner-vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: vectorlist@goonsquad.spies.com Here are the PROM sets from the two European Star Castle boards I received today from Sweden. One set is (C) Opccn Mottoeiss and the other Elettronolo I haven't tried playing them to see if there are game play differences. --al begin 640 EuroSC.zip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